What type of document do you use in Mass in Court in prove vehicle ownership... | MassCops

What type of document do you use in Mass in Court in prove vehicle ownership...

Discussion in 'Court Procedure' started by EnforceOfficer, Jul 30, 2010.

  1. EnforceOfficer

    EnforceOfficer New Member

    I see almost as many MA plates in Ontario as I do NYS and Michigan plates...Got me wondering, for "owner permit" offences in MA, what document does an Enforcement Officer/Prosecutor use in Court to prove that on a particular date, a certain plate was registered to a particular person and address ?

    Here in Ontario, we send away to the Ministry of Transportation a request for certified copies of driver license record, license plate or VIN registration...The $12 processing fee is waived for any public agency with law enforcement authority...The copies must be certified by signature and seal of Registrar of Motor Vehicles, a piece of paper with his/her signature and seal with affixed driver's record or VIN/license plate registration...
     
  2. OfficerObie59

    OfficerObie59 Public Trough Feeder

    I believe you have to be on the vehicle title to register a vehicle at the RMV. Therefore, if the vehicle is registered to you, it's prima facie that you're the owner.
     
  3. Usa8235

    Usa8235 MassCops Member

    OfficerObie is correct...whomever is on the Title is how the vehicle is Registered..the registry clerk types in the info. directly from the Title/RMV1 . That info then pops out on the Registration and is issued on the Title (which is sent to the lienholder or the registrant)
    The vehicle registration shows legally who the registered owner of the vehicle is at the time.
    Our vehicle registrations, just so you know, are pieces of paper...they used to be obnoxious sized cards made of card stock...but, in one of their $$ saving moments, the registry went to paper..a piece of 8x10 piece of paper that does not look very offical...BUT if it has the registrar stamp on it, its the legal proof of ownership. People aren't going to have a Title with them if you stop them --they have to provide that registration.
     
  4. EnforceOfficer

    EnforceOfficer New Member

    Yes we do, I can run any VIN, plate or Driver's license number and get various address, record of offences, date of birth etc. via phone or computer and print it out ...HOWEVER...Big however...They can be included in disclosure to defence as part of your reasonable grounds, but those Ministry of Transportation printouts are considered hearsay evidence by the Courts...

    Officer notes on the details of the vehicles ownership are considered persuasive by the courts, but are not considered proof beyond reasonable doubt of the vehicle's ownership details...

    For an "Owner Permit" offence (eg "Owner-permit use of vehicle for taxi-service, now taxi vehicle license" contrary to municipal By-law" or "C.A.I.A. 2(1)(b) Owner permit operation of motor vehicle on highway - no insurance"), you still need to have a registration print out mailed to you by the Ministry of Transportation under the seal and signature of the Registrar of Vehicles and present such to the Court in order for the Court to accept that on that day, without a reasonable doubt, John Doe of 123 Any Street, Any Town owned the vehicle...

    If you guys can just print of a plate/DL/VIN query and that's acceptable to your Courts to prove ownership, that so much less of a pain in the but compared to here in Ontario...

    Everything has to be certified for use in Court in Ontario...If you charge a homeowner for a "Owner Permit..." offence, and it goes to trial, you have to provide the Court with a certified land titles extract signed by a deputy assistant land registrar (easier to get, anyone who works in the land titles office is appointed as one)...

    If you charge a corporation and it goes to trial, you have to provid the Court with certified copies of Articles of Incorporation under the signature of the Minister of Government Services in order that Court with find that beyond a reasonable doubt the corporation does exist...A print out from a public access government databases which shows the corporation's registration, corp. HQ address etc. doesn't cut it for Ontario's Courts...

    Now in describing the above pain in the buts, once you have all your certified paperwork ducks in a row, convictions for regulatory/administrative matters seem somewhat easier to get in Ontario compared to Mass...For regulatory/administrative offences, you only need to prove actus reus, there is no mens rea proof requirement (R. v. Sault Saint Marie)...
     
  5. EnforceOfficer

    EnforceOfficer New Member

    Ya run some homme from Trois-Riviere, Quebec and get this message back...

    Mandat-Alarmer Sa Majesté -S. 49 Code criminel

    lol...or...hehehehe

    When I run a DL#, I only get traffic-related offences (criminal and administrative), suspensions and driving prohibitions back; I don't get non-traffic related criminal history, as I'm not a Police or Conservation Officer, and have only limited Peace Officer status...

    If I get the crappy 6th sense feeling with someone I'm dealing with, I just call in my location and the name of the person I'm dealing with on my Police radio, and they will tell me if heads up is need...
     
  6. EnforceOfficer

    EnforceOfficer New Member

    What did the Trooper say back ? lol
     

Share This Page