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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I personally don't carry off duty unless I am going into the city. But I can certainly see why some LEOs would feel inclined to carry most of the time off duty. But what about people in the military like MPs fulltime or reserve, they can carry on duty, they get firearms training. Would they be considered LEOs. Certainly they are not trained like a Muni officer to be on the street but you can't tell me that in uniform they could possibly end up at logan airport with a pistol or an AR-1 but are not responsible enough to carry off duty. Just like Aux/specials/reserves/college/COs trained and authorized to carry on duty why not off duty?

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Originally posted by wordstew:
I personally don't carry off duty unless I am going into the city. But I can certainly see why some LEOs would feel inclined to carry most of the time off duty. But what about people in the military like MPs fulltime or reserve, they can carry on duty, they get firearms training. Would they be considered LEOs. Certainly they are not trained like a Muni officer to be on the street but you can't tell me that in uniform they could possibly end up at logan airport with a pistol or an AR-1 but are not responsible enough to carry off duty. Just like Aux/specials/reserves/college/COs trained and authorized to carry on duty why not off duty?

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" No matter what yor LEO status be professional to be respected"
 

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I was an Army MP 89-93. The only time I had police powers was while working a law enforcement shift. When not on a LE shift you were just a regular old soldier, not an off duty cop. Also, the fire arms training that was given did not cover any thing as mundane as weapon retention, shoot/don't shoot, stress shooting... About the only thing it did cover was basic marksmanship and range safety. I can honestly say that the training did not prepare a person for a fight.


Just my
 

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I personally carry most of the time, unless i am just running to the store or something. If I am going out of the house for any lengthy period, I got my rosco. I have already had one run in with a member of my fan club while off duty (and I wasn't packin). Luckily it was in an area with a detail cop and I knew him. Nuff said there. As far as Non-F/T or pure Non cop. If you got an LTC, knock yourself out. I actually encourage it. I teach the BFSC to new gun owners. As long as they aren't a tread, they should get to carry.
 

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In a post 9/11 world I think MP, or any soldier manning a visible security checkpont should be permitted, if not encouraged to carry o/d for personal protection, as long as they do not represent themselves as having police powers. They are placing themselves in peril by standing at these posts, as mundane as they may seem, and there is much evidence to show that terror cells have been probing check points and response patterns. In recent weeks there have been at least 2 instances where it is belivied that false 911 calls reporting a susp. device have been placed to observe the emerg. response. Because of the job these soldiers are providing for us, I would strongly urge them to carry o/d, you never know who is watching you. Be safe...
 

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If someone ( non-LE ) NEEDS to carry a gun, they NEED
thier head evaluated.

anyone ever look at some of the idiots that hang around your local gun shops, talking about their carry guns, and back-up guns, and assault weapons, etc.

for allof you who "recommend" that everyone with an LTC carry, just remember these are the idiots you stop, and enounter. Just because you have an LTC dosen't mean you have a reason, or the brain power to carry a firearm
 

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Excellent post trooper, here are some aditional points. #1 there is clear and convincing evidence that terror cells w/i US are using 911 calls to gauge the response patterns of responders. At all jobs prceed w/ eye toward scene security. Bomb/susp. device calls should be conducted in cordened off areas away from public view as much as possible. When responding to routine jobs in your AOR try to take different approches. Be cognizant before entry of anything not right, ie. lookout or surv. on street f/o bank etc.#2. There were numereous security breaches in the weeks following 9/11 of the ground zero site by numerous middle eastern men. A small number was arrested trying to steal a NYPD response van and uniforms from a staging area in the Bronx in the month directly following the disaster. Numerous utility vans and uniforms were also reported stolen. Also there has been a large pattern developing of pilot/flight attendent uniforms being stolen, and numerous anecdotal reports of middle eastern men following and taking pictures of flight crews to and from work (CNN last night)Everyone should try to be as fammiliar w/ the concealed features of guns such as outlines, waist profiles, pockets etc. An early weapons arrest coul foil a whole op. And most important be smart. Do not run in and play hero w/o any idea of what is going on. As the trgedy of last year proved it is imperative to develop a quick tac plan prior to action, rather than make things up as you go. I hope to God that we all make it home safe this Wed., and that I never have to go through what we went through last year again. Be safe, Be alert, they are here and they are watching.
 

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Off duty weapons and non full-timers

WTF?
:twisted:
 

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mpd61, I couldn't agree with you more dude. ken, you've got a lot to learn pal, it's people like you that would disarm the populous and have only the Police and Military carrying weapons
. So what if a law abiding citizen that I stop is strapped, they aren't the armed people to fear, it's the ones carrying an unlicensed weapon that I'd be nervous about, you too while I'm at it :eek: , smarten up! Also let's not forget our 2nd ammendment, because without the 2nd, you DO NOT HAVE ANY AMMENDMENTS, get it? As far as some of the conversations you supposedly overhear, so what, even if you hear some chooch singing the praises of a 40 round mag over a 30 round mag for his AR-15 does this mean you're going to prejudge all civilian gun owners? What are some of your other prejudices :confused: .
 

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All it takes to get an LTC is a clean record, and a safety certificate. BRAINS and COMMON SENSE are not part of the application.

I understand and respect the 2nd ammendment, but my point is, as law enforcement and military we have a need, and should carry a firearm.

however my point is that just because someone has an LTC, they shouldn't be encouraged to carry a gun. I have seen a variety of persons with LTC's over the years, and I hope some of them never carry, becasue carrying a firearm is easy, but knowing when and how to use it, is another story.

I ( and most everyone on the board) spent 40 hours and 1000 rounds training in the use of a firearm, in the academy, the average joe with an LTC spent 6 hours at a safety course.
 

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I see your point ken about Police having more mandatory training, but that doesn't make all cops more gun savy than civilians, I've seen more than a few PO's that if I were ever in a use of deadly force situation with them, I'd be damn sure I was in back of them :eek: . Also, how many incidents have you had with a properly licensed civilian carrying a firearm, using that weapon inappropriately? I have yet to come accross any in my relatively short career
. Also as far as BRAINS AND COMMON SENSE go, a gun permit isn't the only license I wish that was a requirement for, if people were required to have those two qualities for their driver's license, we'd all be filling out less m/v/a reports, but people in hell
want ice water too.
 

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SPDFITZ... I can't believe that working in a small town wouldn't make you realize the fact that we can't always be everywhere for everyone to protect them in every situation. Wouldn't you want someone you cared about to have a fighting chance against some shitbird who wants to do them harm or break into their home etc.... I have begun to understand that the majority of civilians have been brainwashed into believing that guns are bad and that normal people will never require a gun, but for a police officer who sees the world as it really happens...I am truly shocked at your nievity on the subject.
I have been in all the gun stores and heard the guys talking like nitwits, and they dont't realize what a disservice they are doing to the general public who enjoy and utilize firearms in accordance with the second amendment.
Finally... I would caution you about believing that the pistol course in the academy and the 1000 rounds is somehow a badge of marksmanship or ability to handle yourself with a firearm under stress. Some of those nitwits that you overhear in the gunstores might make a humorous appearance, but I wouldn't mind having a couple of them next to me if the shit hit in the fan like it did in Miami in 1986 or the LA bank robbery!
 

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SPDFITZ said:
If someone ( non-LE ) NEEDS to carry a gun, they NEED <img border="0" alt="[Burning Mad]" title="" src="graemlins/burningmad.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[Burning Mad]" title="" src="graemlins/burningmad.gif" /> thier head evaluated.

anyone ever look at some of the idiots that hang around your local gun shops, talking about their carry guns, and back-up guns, and assault weapons, etc.

for allof you who "recommend" that everyone with an LTC carry, just remember these are the idiots you stop, and enounter. Just because you have an LTC dosen't mean you have a reason, or the brain power to carry a firearm
Fitzy my man......how are ya buddy? I feel compelled to respond to your post. Though I understand where your coming from, I must disagree with you. I know you will bash me silly over this but....

The second amendment guarantees your right as an American citizen to keep and bear arms. I agree that some people lack the brain power and/or common sense to carry, however, until a citizen gives you a specific reason to doubt his "brainpower", common sense, or lack thereof, then we must allow that person to exercise his constitutional rights. Personally, I think a lot of people lack the brain power and/or common sense to VOTE, but I accept the fact that it is a right that they have as an American, and I would give my life to protect the rights of all Americans. Just my 2 cents.

BTW How's my bud Hogan doing? I hear he's working with you now?
 

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Well said kmf. No sense in carrying a badge w/o a weapon. Especially if you don't even have a round chambered. What are u going to say to Danny Dirtbag, "Oh excuse me, I have my badge, but no firearm". "Can u wait to commit that felony, while I run home and pick up my piece"."Hold on don't shoot til I load my weapon". Doesn't fly in the real world. I' m not 100% sure ,but I don't know too many cops that wouldn't take help from another P.O. even if they were off duty.
 

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KMF294....I second that wholeheartedly, spoken like a man who sees the world as it is, not how we'd all like it to be.
 
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