[Irish Wampanoag]

I am wrighting to inform LEOs to be careful of the potency of their OC/Pepper Spray. Myself and other officers at BHCC had a violent incident with a scumbag here at the college Thursday afternoon where we arrested the suspect. Not of course before we wrestled with this piece of shit for about 5 minutes (which is a long time with 20lbs of equipment on) trying to place the handcuffs on him. I finally said WTF I will spray this ass with my OC. I shock the can for a few seconds sprayed him, the aerosol delivery worked perfect got him right in the face and sprayed him twice both with two second squirts. I noticed that nothing was really happening to this kid. Now I have been sprayed with OC about 10 times 5 times in training 5 times resulting in contact exposure. I personally have used it about 5 times in my 8 year career and every time it has been effective clearing out the nasal passages tears making them cry like bitches etc.. But this time nothing. I know it didn't have the effect because I could not smell that sweat burning orangey smell I always do when I spray OC Pepper spray. I literally said WTF but anyway we finally got the guy in cuffs and placed him under arrest me and my partners suffered few bumps, scratches and bruises but nothing serious.

Now in training, I was also an instructor years ago in the use of OC, and I was told that the OC/Pepper fluid did/would not expire and its potency remains the same. Instructors told us it was the aerosol that expired which you as a police officer should check regularly, this is true but let me tell you folks the OC Pepper expires too. I found out the hard way so check your potency on you OC Pepper Spray. PS my can of spray was about 3 years old and I had used it twice earlier about two years ago with no problem. I am not sure but the air may have got in or something to contaminate the OC/Pepper fluid itself.


Please becareful out there

PS sorry for the punctuation etc.. my edit and spell check is not working correctly

 

[Gil]

Along the same lines......

When you are planning on using your OC shoot a test shot on the ground first. Shaking the can is not enough, because the fluid in the tube got sucked up there last time you used it. If the last use was not that recent your spray will have little effect.

 

[PearlOnyx]

Another cause for your problem may have been the person himself. OC does not effect everyone the same. There was a guy in my academy, who after being sprayed directly in the eyes, just wiped it right off and smiled. He could walk right through the 30MM rounds when the went off too, with no effect. The CS/CN put him in some pain though. Personally, I can stand in a cell filled with OC from the fogger with no effect, but getting it in the eyes hurts like all hell. Application method, and the actual chemical make a big difference.
One thing we hit on in training this week, as how alot of guys were carrying non-approved oc products. Make sure you are carrying the right stuff. If your department only approve 2 Million SHU's and you zap somoene with the "Ninja" 5 Million SHU's or some other crazy crap, you'll probably get sued and hung out to dry "Non-approved equipment".

 

[Irish Wampanoag]

It was MK-III 5.5% Pepper Mace

 

[CampusOfficer]

OC will not affect some people at all (See Pearl's response above). Also, some drunk people and people doped up on PCP will not be affected either.

 

[Officer Dunngeon]

Thanks for the reminder, mine's about 5 years old. Whoops.

I was told that people who are used to eating spicy foods are also prone to it, like Latinos. I'm sure you've all heard stories about the Border Patrol spraying the Mexicans running at them and opening their mouths, or the guy who sprays his pizza.

I don't put too much faith into the Latino myth, though... at my training, one of the officers who happened to be Puerto Rican wasn't doing so well when the rest of us were pretty much recovered... but maybe that also had something to do with his freshly shaved face!

 

[q5_po]

Along the same lines......

When you are planning on using your OC shoot a test shot on the ground first. Shaking the can is not enough, because the fluid in the tube got sucked up there last time you used it. If the last use was not that recent your spray will have little effect.

Or you can do as I do, empty half the can in their face :twisted: ! All of my bretheran can attest, I tend to get carried away with it when it comes down to the OC!

 

[Gil]

Along the same lines......

When you are planning on using your OC shoot a test shot on the ground first. Shaking the can is not enough, because the fluid in the tube got sucked up there last time you used it. If the last use was not that recent your spray will have little effect.

Or you can do as I do, empty half the can in their face :twisted: ! All of my bretheran can attest, I tend to get carried away with it when it comes down to the OC!

I seem to remember something in the academy about short burst....

 

[SRRerg]

Since there is no guage on the side of the can, if you use your OC, you should replace the can as soon as possible. As far as test firing, I don't do that. I do give the can a few good shakes before every shift. It's either going to work or it's not.

 

[PearlOnyx]

Ooooh, the fresh shave! That's gotta hurt!

 

[tomahawk]

I have heard too many horror stories in various DT training classes regarding the ineffectiveness of OC on certain subjects. If your scumbag is on PCP, whipping out your trusty MK-III and letting loose is only going to annoy the perp - not really hinder him.

Other people do not have a big problem with it even when they are stone cold sober.

Everyone reacts differently - expect no reaction, and you will be prepared to raise the stakes if necessary.

-Mike :2c:

 

[phuzz01]

That was one of the funn...no, THE funniest thing I have ever heard.

Alex

 

[mpd61]

O/C is still WAY more effective than the old Mace. Any of you old-timers remember that Mace would definately break down and be worthless? It could also de-pigment the skin (Michael Jackson). I used it quite often as a V.A. cop. no way as effective as Pepper. Oleoresin Capsicum being organic is just soooo superior to Mace/CS.

Dunngie!
You can cook with it too!
8)

 

[PearlOnyx]

When you guys get a guy who's all greased up in the holding tank, refusing to cuff up, what do you do with him? In our environment, he'd get "politley restrained" by the shield and five guys in full entry gear. I can't imagine there is much policy in place at PD's for this type of scenario.

 

[Irish Wampanoag]

Happened to me on a stop in the Berkshires one night, guy was drunk and decided he didn't want to be arrested. Starts struggling, he got sprayed and...

nothing.

Fortunately gravity and a hood of a car is usually effective when pepper spray fails.

OTOH, we had a guy going absolutely psycho in our cell one night, clogged the toilet so the floor had flooded, took off all his clothes and was running full speed into the cell door. It was obvious that he needed to be restrained, but this dude was about 210, covered in water and sweat, and it would be fair to say one or more injuries would result from trying to go into the cell to take him down. The Sgt. warned him a few times to settle down, which of course was ignored, then we let him have it with the OC. He sees it coming so he turns around, forgetting he was bareassed and took a hit right down the old asscrack.

The results were memorable. In a half a second he's on the deck, screaming about his ass being on fire, splashing water on it and begging us to help him. He came right to the cell door, stuck his hands thru to get cuffed, and was escorted out to the garage for decontamination - which consisted of the grinning Sergeant spraying him with a hose while the guy turned around, "Get my balls again!"

Just another rabid squirrel from TeePee land...

OUCH yes I could see that being painful the brown hole is exposed membranes. Extremely funny story. My guy was clothed but banging his head on a window of our front entrance I thought he was going to put his head through it lol Then he did it to our cruiser back window on transport. It was like that old expisode of cops when the guy kept hitting his head in the back of the cruiser.

 

[PearlOnyx]

We also use the OC fogger, as well as several orders to be restrained prior to entry. Usually, the guy cries after wallowing in the OC for a few mintues, and backs up to the door. I was wondering what the next step was after the guy says to you, "Screw! That stuff don't hurt! Come and get me!". As I know PD's don't have much gear for this type of situation, nor very much on hand staffing, to drag this type of ass out. I was wondering what the contingency plans for dealing with this sort of situation was. A lot of guys get hurt doing this, fully geared up in a more secure correctional environment. I can only imagine the body count in an understaffed, less secure police department lock up, with not very much equipment for this sort of situation.

 

[Deuce]

A little off the subject but a bit of warning. Our OC cans have a tendency to wear thin in certain areas. More than 1 can has let loose some of it's contents to the dismay of my fellow officers.. Pretty damn funny though when it's not you.... So when you start seeing silver better think about trading it in soon.

 

[dcs2244]

Every time I've seen OC used, it's always effected the cops more than the scumbag. Personally, I prefer the time tested "laying-on of hands".
Much more satisfying.

 

[jettsixx]

There was one guy in our academy that when the instructor sprayed him he says "It didnt effect me can I have another shot....wait there it goes" .The instuctor says too late you asked for it and sprayed him again. I know alot of us were amused. He was one of those cocky know it all types.