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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I know this topic was brought up before in the Constable forum and was debated for awhile. Tuesday I had the pleasure of meeting w/ an attorney for the Secretary of States Office, who I put the question to as to who is and who isnt allowed to use the state seal. He said the seal can only be used by fulltime state employees, I asked him about Constables using the state seal and he said they are not allowed to use it, nor are Hospital police depts, unless it is a state hospital, and private college police are not allowed to use the seal either not even on there badges.

What I also found interesting is that Deputy Sheriffs who work in the jails can have the seal on there badge, however those that work for the Civil Process/ Writ Offices for the Sheriffs Offices can not use the seal because they are not full time state employees but are private business.

Also even though some officers are sworn in as Constables/Deputy Sheriffs or SSPO"S if they do not work for the commonwealth of Massachusetts but instead a private college or hospital, there not allowed to use the seal on there badges or any other capacity, I was told it doesnt matter where the derive there police powers from if the enity they work for is not a state agency there in violation.

 

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I didn't read the afore mention thread, but from what you wrote, auxiliary officers should also NOT wear the seal. Auxiliary are not fulltime (yet I get called at the last minute to do details, which makes it a fulltime on-call position :lol: )

And even though the State created the Auxiliary Position and dictates how we can be used, we get our arrest powers from the city/ town.

SOoooooooooooooo, even though you mention constables & Sheriffs, Am I wrong for having the Seal on my badge? As an Aux
 
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Mortal knight said:
SOoooooooooooooo, even though you mention constables & Sheriffs, Am I wrong for having the Seal on my badge? As an Aux
Hold on tight I am sure some of the boards executioners should be answering your question soon!
 
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Mortal-

what type of arrest powers are you mentioning? the city i work in only grants the auxiliary officers "citizens arrest" or if the aux officer is backing up another ft officer.

i'm not flaming you, just curious :D



Dooty
 

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When we are "called to action" by the Chief of Police, and "in uniform", we have as much police powers as the regular officers of the city, But here is the disclaimer: We can make arrests, BUT it is our Auxiliry Department policy to call the regulars to make the arrest. I was told that the reasoning is liablity. Which makes sense to me. I am not getting paid to wrestle someone to the ground, cuff'em, book them, then take a day (some times several) days off from my PAYING job to sit in court.

So Dooty the short paper answer is same as the regulars, the actual practiced answer, NO POWERS WHAT SO EVER. But the powers are there if we need them.
 

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This is such drivel...I can't stand it!!!!!!!!!!
:shock:

There seem to be only two (2) ways to put this to rest;

1. Have the Massachusetts Secretary-of-State appoint police under MGL CH.22C to go out and end the menace of state-seal abuse.
:L:
or
2. Realize that "advertising or commercial purposes" means relative to making a profit or engaging in commerce. Security/public safety/EMS/etc. are not retail or advertising entities. So in the end, who really gives a rat's ass about this mundane topic?
:-({|=
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Hey from the way I understood what the attorney told me Regular fulltime officers are not technically suppose to use the seal. There suppose to use the seal of the city or town where there employed.

Trivial????????? this subject??? yes I go along w/that, I just thought it was an interesting piece of info though, hey any officer who charges someone w/this this offense in my opinon has serious issues.That would have to be one board cop.

Just my :2c:
 

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so

So almost every cop, firefighter, emt and dispatcher in this state is breaking the law.

I know of only one community in Western MA that uses the city seal on the badges and that is Westfiled (PD and FD).

And yes this is drivel and even if it is illegal for all the above to have the state seal on thier badge I doubt the SP has the time, man power or desire to go and enforce it. Nor do the communities have the money to have the seal of their town/city made into center for all the badges. $$$$
 
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Re: so

MCOA41 said:
So almost every cop, firefighter, emt and dispatcher in this state is breaking the law.
According to the Secretary of State, Yes they are.

City/Town I know of that use there respective seals:

Everett-Pd &Fd
Cambridge-Pd&Fd
Boston-PD&Fd
Chelsea-Pd&FD
Revere -Pd&Fd
Malden -Pd&Fd
Medford-Pd-FD

"I doubt the SP has the time, man power or desire to go and enforce it"

Think again.

Oh dont mistake what I'm saying I think its very trivial, and a waste of SP's time as well as anyone elses, I was just sharing what I heard w/ my fellow board members.

 

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Just my Oppinion here, I agree that Private Colleges should not wear the seal by law. I think that College Police Agencies should create something unique and put the College Seal inside the badge.

Now lets start Blasting my oppinon people!!
 

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I remember a certain past officer on my department, who tried to place a unique seal on his campus police badge and was shot down. I am for the use of the college seal on campus police badges
 
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
OK I'll get the fire burning on Boston Common under my smelter. Everyone who has the Mass seal on their badge but shouldn't, can come there next Saturday and toss their tin into the hot boiling molten metal and we can start from scratch.

Hunter, this is an interesting thread but technically unenforceable. Maybe we should get US AG Ashcroft on this matter after he is through stripping our liberties away. Better yet, get AG Rielly, he likes to make up his own laws as he goes along to suit himself or his favorite voting block.
 
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
HousingCop said:
Hunter, this is an interesting thread but technically unenforceable. Maybe we should get US AG Ashcroft on this matter after he is through stripping our liberties away. Better yet, get AG Rielly, he likes to make up his own laws as he goes along to suit himself or his favorite voting block.
Oh I know, some do though.I wonder how others feel about those who enforce it?

 

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I think it's an interesting topic Hunter. There is a CMR on it but no version available online 950 CMR 34.00 and in comparison, US Code:

Title 4 Chapter 2 § 42. - Same; custody and use of

The Secretary of State shall have the custody and charge of such seal. Except as provided by section 2902(a) of title 5, the seal shall not be affixed to any instrument without the special warrant of the President therefor


What's next? Can't wear the US Flag on right shoulder without a letter from Congress?
Title 4 Chapter 1 § 8

(j)

No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen, and members of patriotic organizations. The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing. Therefore, the lapel flag pin being a replica, should be worn on the left lapel near the heart.
 

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State Seal

When I worked at M.I.T, we had the state seal on our badges and I think they are still using them.

I will never understand why politicians go out of the way to create laws that appear to alienate the different law enforcement agencies from each other.(MSP. municipal, MBTA. campus, etc) in the state.

Mass should catch up with the times and pass a bill that would allow police officers, deputy sheriffs and campus police officers who have graduated from the MPOC academy a "STATE"certified officer who has the lawful authority to make a lawful arrest any where in the state. I know this is a radical idea, but so is elliminating civil service but most will agree of getting rid of it (civil service).

I remember my one of my instructors in the Reading Academy tell the class the biggest grip between police agencies is "Jurisdiction" and boy he was right.
I
 

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Is it really that big of a deal wheather or not a person is wearing a pin or not. I work at a private college and all the officers, security or police wear the MA seal and have since the department was started. To be honest I couldn't care less what pins we wear on our uniform or what the center seal of the badge is.
 
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