Firearm sale question

2749 Views 23 Replies 9 Participants Last post by LenS, Jun 22, 2005

Curious EMT

Discussion Starter · Jun 7, 2005

Ok. Since the AG's Mass Compliance regulations do not apply to guns purhased under a LEO's Badge / ID, can it later be sold to a non-LEO mass resident?

I am thinking 'yes' becasue the AG's regulations only apply to transfer of guns from an FFL to a gun owner (necessary for any out-of-state gun purchase), and do not person-to-person in-state purchases that are reported on the FA10 form by the origional gun owner.

Thanks in advance....

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LenS

· #2 · Jun 7, 2005

Yes you have interpreted the regs correctly.

The AG exempts LE agency and LEO purchase guns for duty use. HOWEVER, the wizards in the state house did NOT include a LE/LEO exemption in the law they passed in 1998. So FFLs couldn't resell your gun to ANYONE in MA legally. As you stated, you can sell it privately to anyone on LTCs and FA-10.

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LenS

· #6 · Jun 10, 2005

There are MA dealers selling some non-compliant guns to MA LEOs. I have seen it happen in front of me. I was also told that at least one of these FFLs got jammed up on this issue.

There is NO legal risk to the officer buying the gun, the non-compliance, fines and criminal acts are strictly on the MA dealer. . .that is how the law was written in 1998. It was actually an anti-MA-dealer law more than an anti-gun law. It does surprise me that none of the MA police supply dealers fought it in the courts.

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LenS

· #10 · Jun 14, 2005

John, The AG is the singular reason why MOST mfrs will NOT submit their guns for MA approval, yet they get CA approval. The testing is very similar so that there is only an incremental cost difference to get tested to both states' standards.

Problem lies with AG REFUSING to tell mfr if their gun meets his requirements (which are sorta fuzzy). Thus they have made a business decision that the risk of lawsuits from AG and fines makes it NOT worthwhile to do business here.

I personally spoke with the National Sales Manager of Taurus and he told me that he sent a team of lawyers to meet with the AG. After getting stonewalled by the AG, they made a business decision that they do NOT want ANY of their guns shipped into MA!

Can't say that I blame them.

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LenS

· #12 · Jun 20, 2005

I believe that the "Millennium" edition was first mfd in 1998 (according to the "Blue Book"). I bought mine (PT-111) under the LE exemption of the AG Regs only two weeks prior to the EOPS "List" (compliance with MGLs) first issuance in Feb 2002.

I was only able to find one in MA prior to my purchase back in 2002. So, I think that there are probably a few guns in-state, but not many.

No, I don't honestly think that the citizens of MA will hold their legislators feet to the fire to change the test/approval laws. The AG can only be stopped by a law that would give the legislature oversight over his Regs, but the legislature has so far decided NOT to deal with it.

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LenS

· #15 · Jun 21, 2005

Curious, he wants us all to head down to FL so that we can anchor what little soil they have against the hurricanes that whack them each year! :roll:

Thanks but no thanks!

BTW, I have my FL CCW but haven't brought anything down there with me (last time in FL was Oct 2003). Did do some shooting at Palm Beach County Sheriffs Dept range (very nice place).

FL is NOT so simple, much of South FL has waiting periods if you don't have a FL CCW. There are more places in FL that you can't legally carry a gun than in MA (only schools/colleges are restricted by law in MA . . . private business or municipal/court security rules do not count).

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LenS

· #17 · Jun 21, 2005

anesthes,

See my post of June 7th in this thread.

That sale was perfectly legal.

Glock is on the EOPS "List", meeting MGLs (which has NO LE exemption).

AG Regs exempt any/all LE duty use purchases. AG does NOT approve of Glocks being sold to the unwashed masses.

Ergo, LEOs can buy Glocks on letterhead legally.

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LenS

· #19 · Jun 22, 2005

PBC, I don't have my FL law info handy, but I do know one place that caused me some serious consternation.

FL prohibits carrying firearms in a police station!

What motivated me to get my FL CCW was that I had been planning on attending a national LE convention in Miami in December of 2001. One of the activities of the convention was that we could (if we wanted to) do a ride-along with Miami-Dade. Year prior one of the attendees (a Philly PO) jumped out of the cruiser and actually had a drug dealer collared before the driver (Miami-Dade) was able to get out of the car and grab the guy. Miami is NOT an area I'd want to be riding around unarmed, and I was told that if we were licensed most of their officers wouldn't have a problem with us CCW'g.

I even called a contact at Miami-Dade and never could get a straight answer if I could or couldn't bring it into the station when we met them for the ride-along. Turned into a moot point anyway since the national LE org's HQ is actually out of NYPD, after 9/11 it wasn't clear that the convention would even happen and I canceled my plans to attend. Currently this national (and local) LE org is in such disarray, that I don't intend to attend any future conventions.

I don't know off-hand (I'd need to research the FL laws again and I'll only do that if I ever intend to head down there again) if CCW is allowed at sporting events, public buildings, restaurants that serve alcohol, etc. in FL since I didn't take it with me in 2003 when I stayed in Boca Raton for 2 weeks.

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LenS

· #21 · Jun 22, 2005

PBC, this was 2001, long before HR218. Like I said, I even called/Emailed them (one of the convention planners who was setting up the ride-along) and couldn't get a straight answer of yes or no.

I carry anywhere in MA as a MA LEO, but even with HR218 there is a restriction that visiting officers have to abide by any civilian restrictions for CCW.

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LenS

· #24 · Jun 22, 2005

PBC FL Cop";p="67403 said:
LenS crafter, next time you come to FLA, call me and we'll take care of you :wink:

Stay safe!!

Thanks, will do! No plans on FL in the near future, but who knows when our friends down there will marry off one of their daughters!

Funny you should use the " LenS crafter" . . . I just returned from my optician. I need to order some custom shooting glasses after a painful 3 days in a Randy Cain Tactical Handgun class. Progressive bifocals that are good for computer work and walking/driving absolutely suck for keeping a sharp front sight in focus!

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