Do pit bulls need a law of their own? (All Pit Bull News) | Page 29 | MassCops

Do pit bulls need a law of their own? (All Pit Bull News)

Discussion in 'Hot Topics' started by kwflatbed, May 3, 2007.

  1. uspresident1

    uspresident1 MassCops Member

    I am sure there are some of these dogs who are not bite happy and have very good owners. However, 99% of the time you hear about a dog bite the breed "Pitbull" is in the story. As DEI8 said it's like owning a tiger or a bear, it's a time bomb. I honestly don't know if there's an ideal solution but ANY dog that runs out into the public and bites a citizen whose just walking along minding their business needs to get put down the same day. End of story. I know there's a lot of dog lovers on here but a dog's life is NOT the same as a human's life.
     
  2. cc3915

    cc3915 Well-Known Member Staff Member

    The information contained in this press release is related to yesterday’s incident involving Nichole Hawkins being attacked and bitten by the pit bull dog at 219 Church Street.

    Woman Injured In Pit Bull Attack ? Follow Up
     
  3. kwflatbed

    kwflatbed MassCops Angel Staff Member

    jettsixx take it from someone who has been involved in all types
    of animal rescue longer than you have been on this planet and
    had a family member mauled by a pitt many years ago, you can
    defend them all you want but the thing you have to remember they
    can and will turn on their owners or family members in a in a minut
    as much as you would like to deny it.
    My neice has had over twenty operations to reconstruct her face
    and to cover other scars and she still bears the fear and the looks
    she gets from strangers.
     
  4. jettsixx

    jettsixx Had enough

    Kw, I know people that have been attacked by German Shepherds as well doesnt mean I want to ban the breed. Any and I do mean any dog can "turn" and any dog can bite is all I am trying to say. As I have said before this is one issue that we will have to agree to disagree on. So before this gets way out of hand :beer_yum:
     
  5. Delta784

    Delta784 Guest

    German Shepherds are the second most popular breed in the United States, never falling out of the Top 5 in the last 10 years. Depending on what your definition of "pit bull" is, anything related to that breed doesn't even crack the Top 50;

    AKC Dog Registration Statistics

    Now, go Google "Pit bull attacks" and "German Shepherd attacks", and you'll see that pit bulls have over 1,000,000 (one million) more hits than German Shepherds.

    In legal terms, that's called res ipsa loquitur (the thing speaks for itself).

    Long ago in this thread, I asked a question to the pit bull apologists that no one ever answered, so I'll give it another shot.

    If there were news reports every week that Dodge Caravans were spontaneously exploding, killing and maiming hundreds of people, would you continue to load your family into your Dodge Caravan and just keep on truckin' down the road?

    Bueller?

    Anyone?
     
  6. jettsixx

    jettsixx Had enough

    I think you are comparing apples and moon rocks as you say, however my question would be are these Caravans adequately maintained, and blowing up for no reason? You cant compare inanimate objects to living things. You said that yourself when I have asked before a similar question. There are numerous stories about guns in the wrong hands killing people do you blame the gun or the person firing it? It comes down to responsible ownership. I know we will never agree on this subject and I dont think either of us has a chance in hell of convincing the other to change. Again I think we need to agree to disagree on this. Our personal experiences with the breed are obviously different.
     
  7. DEI8

    DEI8 Supporting Member

    Jett that is not a good comparison, guns are not able to think for them selves or are they able to act on there own intuition, a pit bull does have that ability, they make decisions and act on them of there own will. It is just an instinct that they have all animals have tendensies, Just like labs have the instict to retrieve, beagles chase, pit bulls attack and fight, unfortionately even when unprovoked.
     
  8. jettsixx

    jettsixx Had enough

    I agree that a gun by itself cannot kill you, that is my point a minivan cant do anything to you either however Delta used that as a reference I understand what he is trying to say though. Yes I will take my chances with my pit and I will be a responsible owner as well. If that same minivan can be driven safely and not explode as long as you do not go over a certain speed, do you think there are people that could own them responsibly? While a gun by itself cannot kill you that same gun in the wrong hands could. If you have a child that got their hands on that same gun would it not be dangerous. You prevent that by "training" your child do you not?

    If you look at the history of dog fighting you will see that yes they were bred to attack other dogs. Human aggressive dogs were culled not bred. The last thing a dog fighter wanted was to be breaking up the fight and have the dog turn on them.
     
  9. 7costanza

    7costanza Supporting Member

    I love when a dead thread turns into a heated but RESPECTFUL debate.
     
  10. jettsixx

    jettsixx Had enough

    I do have to agree 7 with 73 pages and neither side willing to concede their position yet we can still agree to disagree without hating each other.
     
  11. DEI8

    DEI8 Supporting Member

    I will gladly agree to disagree as long as you agree with me first.:shades_smile:
     
  12. Delta784

    Delta784 Guest

    Yes...kind of like the numerous stories in this thread about "gentle and loving" pit bulls turning on people.

    A gun is a thoughtless, emotionless object that needs the conscious decision of a human to be dangerous. They are totally predictable; don't squeeze the trigger, and they're not going to fire. Pit bulls are living, thinking creatures who have been bred to be aggressive and fight/kill other dogs; their mere presence is dangerous due to their unpredictability. I don't even get mad at the dogs when they maul someone, since they're just doing what they were designed to do. Who I do get mad at are the irresponsible owners who have placed so many innocent people at risk by making the decision to have a timebomb come live in the neighborhood.

    I just find it baffling that any rational person can read this thread and not come to the conclusion that there is a serious problem with these dogs.
     
  13. vttroopah

    vttroopah dirtbaggumus maximus

    I tried that google thing and it works!

    I googled "good cops" and found 596,000 results
    I googled "bad cops" and found 1,580,000 results

    I can now FULLY concur with the media and google that there are more bad cops than good ones.


    I own 2 pit bulls (am staff, staff terrier, whatever you want to call them). They are rescues from some crackhead asshole that left them for dead as babies. Both are great dogs and I understand many people will always think they are going to attack. The finality of the statements made by posters here is surprising. I was treated very poorly by a policeman when I was a child and I watched corrupt cops do their dirty work on my doorstep. I learned to understand these few men were the minority of a great brotherhood. I didn't create the idea that ALL cops are dirty or SOONER OR LATER a cop will become dirty. I saw it as an anomaly and a sore on a great profession.

    I have been attacked by dog(s) over five times in my life. Two Dobies, a golden, a golden, a hound, a golden, and a shepherd. I hate golden retrievers, but I don't believe they ALL are man-eating beasts.

    Pit bulls are like AK 47s. They are both bred for fighting and not stopping. I own an AK and will admit it's not accurate, it's heavy, it's noisy and rattles, but it's a very pure and the most widely used weapon. In the wrong hands or at time of war it is designed to kill. My pit bulls are the same. They will protect my family in time of war, but they are fun and playful at the range. I've heard ALOT of people on here proudly state that their dog would eat/kill/attack any would-be robbers and rapists.

    Let's look at the animal owners that have bred and raised dogs that "snap" and attack humans. Hold them accountable and blame them the same way we blame them for raising criminal children. Right now the epidemic is not pit bulls, but that hood-rat, white trash, ghetto animals chose these dogs as weapons. For you folks that work the city back in the late 70's and early 80's, no one had pit bulls. The dog of choice was dobies and rotties and they were always trying to ban them. Every 10-15 years, the lower echelon of society chooses a dog to be it's dirtbag mascot. Unfortunately right now it's the pit bull.

    Pit bulls have been widely bred since the 1800's. Why the hysteria now? Media? Did they only start attacking people in the last 10 years? During the 50's and 60's these were normal family dogs, but somehow their DNA changed them into killing machines after their appearance on a DMX album cover.

    Rant over.
     
  14. kwflatbed

    kwflatbed MassCops Angel Staff Member

    "Pit bulls have been widely bred since the 1800's. Why the hysteria now?
    Media? Did they only start attacking people in the last 10 years?"

    VT my niece is 46 years old and she was attacked when she was six years old by a
    pit that was a family dog raised in a house with kids, she was attacked in her own
    yard while playing on her swing set. Both her yard and the pits owners yards were
    fenced and the pit had to jump both fences to get at her.
    We don't know what triggered the pit to attack but it did, so it is not just the last 10 years.
    Yes they have been bred since the 1800's but what were they bred and trained to do ??
     
  15. jettsixx

    jettsixx Had enough

    KW it's right there YOU DONT KNOW, so because of this one dog that your family member had a bad experience with you want to wipe out an entire breed?
    When I was a teenager I was jumped by five guys that happened to be of minority, they beat the living hell out of me, numerous injuries, luckily nothing permanent, at least physically, although for several years I thought every person of another color was like that. When I was in my teen years I was the biggest racist you would have ever met. Then something happened I got older and realized that you cant possibly judge everyone based on the actions of a few. I often wonder how many good people I missed out on knowing just because I was so closed minded back then.

    This is just how I see this, I see people judging an entire breed just because every newspaper in the country decides to run a story if it involves a Pit. One case of a dog bite we had here the reporter asked me what kind of dog it was, when I told him it was a beagle he lost interest in the story. I asked why and he told me beagles bites dont sell papers.

    Now I would like to ask all of you, that are against the breed, a question. What is the difference between you hating an entire breed of dog just because of the breed, and the younger me that hated everyone of a particular race? Sounds to me like they are both prejudices. I've come right out and said what a moron I was when I was a teenager. I cant seem to find the difference. Take it how you want but I am not "race baiting" I am however trying to figure out why you find your prejudice is ok?
     
  16. DEI8

    DEI8 Supporting Member

    I am not going to answer that. Every responce I come up with is just leading down another road.
     
  17. LGriffin

    LGriffin Always Watching

    I don't want the breed anywhere near my kids but frankly i'm like that with most breeds since my kids are young. In my area, Pits are mainly owned by scumbags and gang bangers. I don't like their appearance and I believe there's a nature/nurture issue at play with them so i'd rather not find out whether they have bad genes or weren't raised right. Just because the news of their issues didn't come out so fiercely long ago doesn't mean it didn't happen, sort of like how priests and little boys just came out around that same time...word travels over the net.

    Given the facts, Pits are like dealing with a scumbag with multiple ABPO's on his record. That said, even a small dog can do some ankle damage if they feel threatened or have aggression issues so i'm always respectful of a dogs turf. Right now, we don't own a dog and it really pisses me off when dopey dog owners ease off on the leash to let their dog near my kids when we are outside. YOU feed your dog and they'll protect YOU if they feel threatened so of course your dog "doesn't bite" (you).

    ---------- Post added at 09:23 ---------- Previous post was at 09:18 ----------

    Jett, i'm equal opportunity. I believe every race has it's shit but i'd rather proceeding with caution than bleed out.
     
  18. Delta784

    Delta784 Guest

    Are you serious? Is your position so intellectually bankrupt that you have to try to play the race card in a debate about DOGS???

    REALLY???

    I can't believe I have to actually explain this, but race is a benign, non-behavioral characteristic. A dog's breeding is ALL about behavior; as someone else mentioned, purebred dogs are often bred to have certain traits and behaviors; Retrivers retrieve, bloodhounds track, and pit bulls attack and maim. Breed IS behavior.

    I still can't believe you actually tried to inject racism into this. Pretty pathetic, IMO.

    ---------- Post added at 16:22 ---------- Previous post was at 16:11 ----------

    Invalid comparison; your AK-47 will lie totally dormant until eternity with absolutely, positively no chance whatsoever of harming anyone, unless a human makes a conscious decision to load it and fire it. Pit bulls are walking timebombs whose mere presence endangers everyone, because no one knows when or where they'll explode.

    If pit bulls mauled only robbers and rapists, I'd get one myself. However, we know that to not be true (see hundreds of news articles in this thread).

    From: http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/how-to-defeat-a-pit-bull-with-your-bare-hands/Content?oid=3708968

    "Fact: Any breed of dog is capable of attacking a human. But 56 percent of all fatal dog attacks in the United States in the past five years were committed by pit bulls, according to a report released last week by the organization DogsBite.org. "During the 1980s and 1990s, fatal dog attacks averaged 17 per year. The death-by-dog-bite rate now is nearly double this amount at over 30 per year and largely due to pit bulls," the group says".

    Ooops.....there's those pesky facts getting in the way of a good argument again.
     
  19. BrickCop

    BrickCop Subscribing Member

    I'm sure Jettsix and vt are responsible Pit owners whose dogs have never harmed anyone. Having said that the breed is a time bomb. It doesn't matter if an aggressive PB has the proverbial 'bad owner' as it attacks a child or rips someone's pet beagle to shreds.

    I'll respectfully venture into the PB apologist hyperbole by substituting the word 'owners' for parents. There is no such thing as a bad rapist, only bad parents of rapists. Sounds dumb, right? Exactly.

    Are all PBs vicious? No but again nobody gives a crap about the owner of the vicious ones as they are attacking. As long as PBs are easily bought as jellybeans they will disproportionately be far more DANGEROUS than most other breeds "with a bad owner".
     
  20. jettsixx

    jettsixx Had enough

    Wasnt trying to play the race card Delta, although I knew you would take it that way. My point is why is your prejudice ok? Has everything to do with Pre Judging something or someone. So if I said that arguing with the grand dragon of the KKK was like beating your head against the wall the only thing you would see is that I made referance to the KKK and over look the fact that what I am trying to say is that you cannont change someones mind that is unwilling to change. I'm done dealing with the ignorance here.
     
  21. Delta784

    Delta784 Guest

    Because it's backed up by facts and involves the safety of me and my family. I don't like it when irresponsible people make decisions that impact me and my loved ones.

    You might want to check out #3 to realize how absurd your comparison is;

    http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/...bull-with-your-bare-hands/Content?oid=3800677

    BTW....you do know we're talking about DOGS here, right?

    Translation - All my points have been refuted and I'm out of ammunition.
     
  22. cc3915

    cc3915 Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Raw video of the Lowell incident.

    [nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0BJgTAiygc"]YouTube - Video 3.MP4[/nomedia]



    I was waiting for Dicky Eklund or his sisters to make an appearance.
     
  23. Delta784

    Delta784 Guest

    Heartwarming, isn't it?

    What do you suppose the timebomb's owner said? Let's all say it together......"He's so gentle and loving at home".
     
  24. cc3915

    cc3915 Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Yes, I saw the interview with the female owner of the dog and she looked like a methed out Morticia Addams with neck tats. Disgusting what people do with these animals.
     
  25. Lost

    Lost MassCops Member

    I tried Google out, and I'm not sure if I did it right, but this was on the first page of results.

    http://nationalcanineresearchcouncil.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/2009-DBRF-Booklet-FINAL-11.pdf

    My favorite quote that describes the phenomenon is this one:
    (sorry for the formatting, I left it as is for academic integrity).

    One of the confirmed pit bulls listed in the attacks is listed as being permanently chained up outside. Most dogs would not be well socialized in that environment.

    Look, any dog can do damage- especially large ones. If you have a pittie and you haven't undergone extensive training, shame on you. That carries true if you have ANY type of large dog that you don't train.

    As far as the population of pit bulls, most are not AKC papered. They are bred in backyards, alleys, etc. They are the most populous dog in the US. I can find websites that prove that point as well:
    https://defendpitbulls.com/pit-bull-attack-statistics/

    Even highly trained police dogs can "turn" in a minute. I'm sure plenty of us have heard of K-9's biting officers, their handlers- even escaping and biting a passerby (I can't remember where in Mass this happened, but it was fairly recent).

    I don't expect to change your mind Delta. And KW, I'm horrified to hear of your niece. I understand your vantage point.

    All dogs can be dangerous, big or small. If you are willing to accept a dog into your home, train him well, and don't leave toddlers around them alone to poke and pressure.
     

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