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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
What is the definition of a weapon being concealed? Just wondering where the "line" is because on Cops a person was charged with a concealed weapon that was in plain site. Does it vary state to state?
 

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VERY different state to state.
Basically there is concealed (not showing, printing, or exposed) carry and open carry (in the open, visable, essentially not concealed)

Some states, like NC have no rules regarding open carry, but have rules for cocealed carry - meaning you can open carry without a permit but must have a permit for concealed carry.

Some states don't care at all either way so long as the handgun is not being carried for unlawful purposes - VT.

Some states only allow concealed carry with a permit, and do not allow open carry at all, like MA.

Also the level of "concealed" might come into play as far as "how visable" the firearm is at all times.

For example in NC, if you got into your car, while doing open carry and the seat blocked the view of the firearm, that was concealed and a violation. Basically the handgun would have to be in plain view at all times...which was sort of odd as people would put the gun on the front seat while driving.

stm4710";p="54892 said:
What is the definition of a weapon being concealed? Just wondering where the "line" is because on Cops a person was charged with a concealed weapon that was in plain site. Does it vary state to state?
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Ok this sounds like a quagmire to me. How can I John Q take my gun to a gun range or out hunting if I cant have it in the open but I dont got a CCW? :?
 

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Because there are other laws that allow you to do that.

You may carry a loaded rifle or shotgun in public while lawfully engaged in hunting during hunting season (license, 500 inches of blaze orange, and organge cap) - hunting regulations.

You may participate in shooting events at a bonafide range or on YOUR personal property if allowed by local laws and in compliance with state laws, every day of the week. You may not shoot on public land on Sunday - again hunting regs.

When transporting a firearm to and from the range or to hunting, it must be unloaded, locked in a case, trunk, bla bla bla...and ammuntion should be seperate and I would say locked in a case as well - unless you are carrying concealed under a Class A LTC with no restrictions.
The same basically goes for all long guns and in fact NO long gun may be loaded while on/in a vehicle.

Note that Firearm means handgun in MA...so it's a bit confusing and they seem to swap the terms now and again.

stm4710";p="54895 said:
Ok this sounds like a quagmire to me. How can I John Q take my gun to a gun range or out hunting if I can have it in the open but I dont got a CCW? :?
 

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The same "statute" that give you your Class A. You are allowed to carry the firearm for "all lawful purposes"...now somewhere in this world someone tried the "open carry" and it was determined in MA that open carry creates a public nusiance at which point that is considered an "unlawfull purpose". You can only carry for "lawful purposes".

Now certainly if you would like to fight that, I would say yes it's a free country do what you feel you must. Even if you are "proved right" -which you will not be, you will lose as will all other firearms owners in MA.
It will cost you money, lots of it. It will create a stink where there need not be. Since your permit is issued by an authority that has total discretion as to you getting that Class A, I will bet that you will not get a renewal for your LTC the next time around even if you do "win". You would be considered an "unsuitable person" and there wouldn't be a review board that could help you.

Now someone then read further and note that the class b says that you can not carry a loaded firearm, but doesn't say anything about carrying an unloaded firearm- what should you do.

Just a side note (in general):
In the whole scope of things, MA guns laws are confusing and they suck. Most of the instructors in the state are not trying to break balls about what you should do and what you shouldn't do. Many of us spend a lot of time trying to figure this out with lawyers, in classes, in presentations like Chief Glidden presents. From that take that there are YEARS of experience, reviews of all kinds of conflicting laws, not just for you as a person but for dealers as well. You are getting, often times, the best advice that can be given due to experience, first hand knowledge, and a study of the laws. If you want to go against that, like I said it's a free country but you will lose for winning.

Curious EMT";p="54894 said:
SOT_II";p="54893 said:
Some states only allow concealed carry with a permit, and do not allow open carry at all, like MA.
What is the Statute regarding this?
 

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stm4710";p="54895 said:
Ok this sounds like a quagmire to me. How can I John Q take my gun to a gun range or out hunting if I cant have it in the open but I dont got a CCW? :?
Since you say that you don't have a "CCW", a few more things need to be qualified here:

- Under MGLs, you aren't eligible for a LTC (that's what they call our MA "CCW") until you are 21 (I notice that your profile says you are 20).
- Under MGLs, a Resident of MA can not legally be in possession of any gun unless they possess the proper permit (LTC for handguns/rifles/shotguns or FID for some rifles/shotguns).

So, if you don't have a LTC or FID of the proper "class" (high capacity guns require a different class LTC/FID than a low capacity gun), you can NOT take it to the range, shoot it at a club or on your own property, etc. unless you are with an adult who does possess the proper class permit.
 

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More clarification:

If you do not have any form of FID/Class A or B, you can not own a firearm or rifle or shotgun. However you MAY use a firearm rifle or shotgun while accompanied by an individual that has the appropriate license for said firearm, rifle, or shotgun.
You may own a blackpowder gun, but you may not buy the components that make it go "boom". Nor will you be able to buy any form of ammunition.

Even MORE clarification:
In MA you can NO LONGER own a firearm in your home without having a license that matches the types of guns you have. For example if you have a single shot rifle in your home, minimum is an FID. If you have a 6 shot revolver, minimum would be a Class B, if you have a Glock 17 (high capacity capable firearm) you would need a Class A.

LenS";p="54901 said:
stm4710";p="54895 said:
Ok this sounds like a quagmire to me. How can I John Q take my gun to a gun range or out hunting if I cant have it in the open but I dont got a CCW? :?
Since you say that you don't have a "CCW", a few more things need to be qualified here:

- Under MGLs, you aren't eligible for a LTC (that's what they call our MA "CCW") until you are 21 (I notice that your profile says you are 20).
- Under MGLs, a Resident of MA can not legally be in possession of any gun unless they possess the proper permit (LTC for handguns/rifles/shotguns or FID for some rifles/shotguns).

So, if you don't have a LTC or FID of the proper "class" (high capacity guns require a different class LTC/FID than a low capacity gun), you can NOT take it to the range, shoot it at a club or on your own property, etc. unless you are with an adult who does possess the proper class permit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
LenS";p="54901 said:
stm4710";p="54895 said:
Ok this sounds like a quagmire to me. How can I John Q take my gun to a gun range or out hunting if I cant have it in the open but I dont got a CCW? :?
Since you say that you don't have a "CCW", a few more things need to be qualified here:

- Under MGLs, you aren't eligible for a LTC (that's what they call our MA "CCW") until you are 21 (I notice that your profile says you are 20).
- Under MGLs, a Resident of MA can not legally be in possession of any gun unless they possess the proper permit (LTC for handguns/rifles/shotguns or FID for some rifles/shotguns).

So, if you don't have a LTC or FID of the proper "class" (high capacity guns require a different class LTC/FID than a low capacity gun), you can NOT take it to the range, shoot it at a club or on your own property, etc. unless you are with an adult who does possess the proper class permit.
Len, I dont have any permit or LTC nor submitted an application for any. The example you quoted was postulated by me to ask what "John Q Public" would do in what appeared to be a cache 22 situation based on the post by SOT II that appeard to me(someone with no knowledge of gun laws) over the post of mine in which you quoted.

The advice and discussion here is mearly just to satisfy the little itch in my brain about what I saw on a Cops episode. The advice given here will not be used in practice. Standerd disclaimers apply, no expiration date. :wink:
 
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