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Main Page Municipal Sgt./Lt. Exam 2005
(Click here to view the original thread on the MassCops Message Board)

Posted by: Bluestar

Wondering if anyone has heard anything new concerning this test and or the questions. Any information re: appealed questions? I know the results will be announced on Jan. 23rd which is ridiculous.

Another thing -- Where is John Scheft and Pat Rogers???? Nothing on their web sites and no correspondence? It can't be that they are accessible for the test prep money and nothing else - RIGHT? These guys are like used car salesmen right now - Once you buy the car - They're GONE!

Posted by: Clouseau

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluestar

Another thing -- Where is John Scheft and Pat Rogers???? Nothing on their web sites and no correspondence? It can't be that they are accessible for the test prep money and nothing else - RIGHT? These guys are like used car salesmen right now - Once you buy the car - They're GONE!

Just curious, what are you expecting from these guys?
They help you prepare for upcoming exams, sell books, study guides etc. nothing else.
Later, after the results are out, they sometimes make available a simulated copy of the last test. Until they obtain feedback from test takers that have received their marks, they don't know anything more than you do.

What more are you expecting?

Posted by: bluesamurai22

You're gonna have to wait till the 23rd to know for sure. I know for a fact that someone is working on the reconstruction for John Scheft. The biggest problem has been that a lot of people who said they would send in questions haven't been doing so.

Do you remember any of the questions or answers and their corresponding numbers? If you are in such a hurry to get the reconstruction done you should send them in here:

http://www.ledimensions.com/index.ph..._id=4&Itemid=1

From the answer matrix we threw together (now 15 people plus the Danvers consensus) it looks like questions 10,17,18 and 29 had the biggest jumble of different answers. The law questions were horrible this year, there were only 1 or 2 law questions that everyone agreed on.

The average number of test questions where multiple answers have been accepted is about 3%. I'm guessing this test has at least 3 and possibly as many as 6 (of 100).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluestar

Wondering if anyone has heard anything new concerning this test and or the questions. Any information re: appealed questions? I know the results will be announced on Jan. 23rd which is ridiculous.

Another thing -- Where is John Scheft and Pat Rogers???? Nothing on their web sites and no correspondence? It can't be that they are accessible for the test prep money and nothing else - RIGHT? These guys are like used car salesmen right now - Once you buy the car - They're GONE!

Posted by: Bluestar

Quote:

Originally Posted by bluesamurai22

You're gonna have to wait till the 23rd to know for sure. I know for a fact that someone is working on the reconstruction for John Scheft. The biggest problem has been that a lot of people who said they would send in questions haven't been doing so.

Do you remember any of the questions or answers and their corresponding numbers? If you are in such a hurry to get the reconstruction done you should send them in here:

http://www.ledimensions.com/index.ph..._id=4&Itemid=1

From the answer matrix we threw together (now 15 people plus the Danvers consensus) it looks like questions 10,17,18 and 29 had the biggest jumble of different answers. The law questions were horrible this year, there were only 1 or 2 law questions that everyone agreed on.

The average number of test questions where multiple answers have been accepted is about 3%. I'm guessing this test has at least 3 and possibly as many as 6 (of 100).

Sorry to come down hard on Scheft and Rogers - I guess I'm just anxious to get the mark back. I just wish some informal feedback was provided on their web sites, ie: the "Forum" on Scheft's site that is not in operation and would be great during the wait! I actually did send in several questions to both sites, although I did not recall the numbers of the questions. Thanks for your help. I was going to call Civil Service tomorrow re: a possible answer re the number of appealed questions.

Posted by: bluesamurai22

Send me your e-mail if you are interested in our answer matrix. I think we are at the point where we can guess how well people have done.

If you are a good test taker (90's) and put in some serious time I would be very interested in what you had for answers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluestar

Posted by: Bluestar

Bluesamurai - Tried to send a message to you but you have to "clear space" in your message inbox to recieve further messages -- Bluestar

Posted by: bluesamurai22

Sorry...

I just cleaned out my inbox and sent messages box.

Actually, if anyone else is interested please e-mail me your answers in a single column (with no numbers) like this:

A
B
C
D
etc...

You can send it to gamills-a t-burlmass.org replace the "-a t-" with an @. (I type it this way to keep spam bots from finding my address for junk-mail)

Once I get your answers I will cut and paste you into the Excel sheet and e-mail the whole mess back to you. Please tell me who you are and what kind of test history you have too. I will just put you in the sheet by your intials or only your first name.

Thanks

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluestar

Bluesamurai - Tried to send a message to you but you have to "clear space" in your message inbox to recieve further messages -- Bluestar

Posted by: Bluestar

Boston has received their marks - Municipal marks to be sent by January 4th !!

This according to the HRD received.

Posted by: Piper

I heard the scores are out online today but when I logged on with HRD it said that the scores were sent out already. My buddy who took the Sgt exam said his score was posted online but I took the LT test and mine was not. Anyone else get the same?

-Thanks

Piper

Posted by: bluesamurai22

A few of us here got our marks online this morning - at least 2 who took the LT's got them.

I'm very happy with what I got.

Posted by: Gil

Got mine online for the sgt's test, thanks god it was only a practice exam for me

Posted by: Bluestar

My mark was posted on the HRD website. Happy with mine as well !!! Now comes the gam e of tracking down the other scrores !

Posted by: Piper

I checked again online this morning and still no score, only the statement that the scores were sent. I checked w/ the other 3 Sgt's on my PD who tested for Lt and theirs say the same thing. Its weird because the Ptl who took the Sgt exam on my dept got their scores online yesterday.

This couldn't suck worse.
I need to go to the thread about revamping civil service so I can vent!

Posted by: Piper

I got my score finally (pretty happy with it too), but had to call them a bunch of times. Turns out they are sending cards to the four guys on my Dept who tested Lt and they will all have 0% on them as scores. New cards will be sent on monday with the correct scores.

And to think I always defended Civil Service on this site.......

Posted by: Piper

Any thoughts on when we can expect a valid list passed down from HRD?
-Piper

Posted by: Gil

I would think no sooner than the end of January due to the appeals.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piper

Any thoughts on when we can expect a valid list passed down from HRD?
-Piper

Posted by: Bluestar

Does anyone know when appointments can be made from the Oct. 2005 test? Does a chief have to wait until the past list has expired in March of 06 or can he/she use this list after all appeals are decided upon?

Posted by: Clouseau

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piper

Any thoughts on when we can expect a valid list passed down from HRD?
-Piper

For the last test, October 2004, the list was not certified and posted until March 31.
Don't hold your breath. {Almost 6 months}.

Bluestar, the new list isn't certified until all the appeals are in. Once the new list is certified, the old list is finished. I have seen depts. make promotions just before the old list was to expire.{Depends on who's on it}.

Posted by: Bluestar

How about this question:

Can a chief appoint an "acting" Sgt. even when there is a current existing list (2004 test) and an upcoming 2006 certification in March? (The acting position given on department seniority basis.)

This being done assuming that the chief would rather use the upcoming list rather than the soon to expire list.

Posted by: bluesamurai22

If there is an established list and no excusable reason to make an acting, provisional or temporary position I would say no way.

See MGL C. 31 for all of the rules on various types of promotions - http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/gl-31-toc.htm

They can rush appointments to get to people on older lists or they can drag their feet to get to people on upcoming lists but they can't just do whatever they feel like doing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluestar

How about this question:

Can a chief appoint an "acting" Sgt. even when there is a current existing list (2004 test) and an upcoming 2006 certification in March? (The acting position given on department seniority basis.)

This being done assuming that the chief would rather use the upcoming list rather than the soon to expire list.

Posted by: irish937

How can a chief just disregard an active list? He's opening himself up for serious morale issues and litigation. If the top on the list is a viable candidate, then he/she should be put in as a permanent appointment. If not, then so on down the list. Not appointing from an active list is arbitrary, UNLESS there are no VIABLE candidates. This being said, would anyone really want a job that was appointed like that? Do you take the test every year? October 2004 test certified March 31, 2005.

Posted by: Bluestar

Since the marks were released weeks before the January 23rd date originally given by HRD, is it possible that the new list could be certified well before the given date of March 31st ?

Posted by: Piper

I emailed HRD and they told me the new list for Sgt/Lt/Capt from the '05 exam won't be out until the end of March or the beginning of April. This after they screw up my PD's Lt scores by first sending us cards with 0's on them!
How can it take so long?

their response below:
"The majority of eligible lists from the October 2005 Police Promotional Exams should be established around March 31st or in early April.

Sincerely,
CivilService@hrd.state.ma.us"

Posted by: Bluestar

I was e-mailed by HRD today and told that the list should be certified on March 24th. Who knows.....

Posted by: Piper

Here's to hoping that there are 13 more days to the new promotion list for Muni Sgt/Lt/Capt!

Posted by: Piper

7 more days to the new list????

Posted by: FORTIER26

be careful of waht you wish for....the grass is always greener over the cesspool

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piper

7 more days to the new list????

Posted by: Piper

was it greener in Fla, Fortier?
welcome back

Posted by: Piper

think the list will be out tomorrow, the 24th?

Posted by: Bluestar

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piper

think the list will be out tomorrow, the 24th?

Would be nice, but... I would bet that Civil Service is no rush to establish a list on the day that the old list expires. That would be too efficient for them. Probably sometime before Friday of next week. Then again, maybe an official from Civil Service will read this, be offended, and have the list established on the correct day !!!!

To all those on the expiring list..... SEE YA !

Posted by: 94c

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluestar

the old list never has an expiration date. It naturally expires on the day the new one gets certified whenever that is.

Posted by: Bluestar

Quote:

Originally Posted by 94c

the old list never has an expiration date. It naturally expires on the day the new one gets certified whenever that is.

And... Where was I wrong in my post? When Civil Service establishes the new list - probably sometime next week - the new list takes over. You must be on the expiring list - SEE YA.

Posted by: Piper

just checked HRD, still no list.....
so much for the 24th

Posted by: 94c

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluestar

And... Where was I wrong in my post? When Civil Service establishes the new list - probably sometime next week - the new list takes over. You must be on the expiring list - SEE YA.

negative. number 1 on the new list and number 1 on the old. Doesn't make a difference either way.

Posted by: Bluestar

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piper

just checked HRD, still no list.....
so much for the 24th

The Civil Service guy in charge of the new list is going to hit the "new list" button while he's walking out of the building at 4:00 PM and - VOILA !! New List.

Reality = Next Friday

Posted by: Piper

Dude, I so see some over weight/state employee for life/IT weeny sitting at his dishevelled HRD desk with my PD's new Lt's list in front of him on his PC screen and his fat nicotine stained finger is poised over the "send" button. As he is about to bring the nasty thing down he recalls the ticket he got last week and grins through his crooked teeth as he says to himself, "f-'em for another week." The load then waddles his gelatinous self out for a butt break as I continue to check the HRD website like a dope.
But I'm not bitter.......

Posted by: Bluestar

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piper

Dude, I so see some over weight/state employee for life/IT weeny sitting at his dishevelled HRD desk with my PD's new Lt's list in front of him on his PC screen and his fat nicotine stained finger is poised over the "send" button. As he is about to bring the nasty thing down he recalls the ticket he got last week and grins through his crooked teeth as he says to himself, "f-'em for another week." The load then waddles his gelatinous self out for a butt break as I continue to check the HRD website like a dope.
But I'm not bitter.......

I spoke to him on the phone yesterday ! No, wait -- that couldn't be, because you can only speak with automated machines at the always busy CS !

Check the HRD website - Looks like the lists are ready to use, but will not be posted on the internet until March 31.

Posted by: Piper

I copied this from the HRD website:

Last Update March 24, 2006 4:00 p.m. Eastern

Police Sergeant, Police Lieutenant & Police Captain
Police Departmental Promotional Examination
Exam Date October 22, 2005

The scores for the October 22, 2005 Boston Police Sergeant, Lieutenant & Captain Series of exams were released on Friday, December 16, 2005. The last day to appeal an Education & Experience score is January 3, 2006.

All scores for the October 22, 2005 Police Sergeant, Lieutenant & Captain series (except for the Boston Police Dept) were released on Tuesday, December 27, 2005. The last day to appeal an Education & Experience score is January 14, 2006.

The majority of eligible lists from the October 2005 Police Promotional Exams will be established on March 24, 2006 and will available via our online system around March 31st. A few eligible lists will be established in early April and will be available via our online system soon after that date.

That fat guy is totally f-ing with me....

Posted by: bluesamurai22

I'll show all of them...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piper

That fat guy is totally f-ing with me....

Posted by: bluesamurai22

Give him back his stapler and he'll post the list.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bluesamurai22

I'll show all of them...

Posted by: Piper

Blue,
you ID'd the prick for me!
now just to get an R-8 on the guys wheels......vengence will be mine

Posted by: Piper

posting the fat body's picture did the trick, the list is finally out!
And if I might add, my name looks fine sitting high atopt the Lt's list.

Posted by: policelaborlaw.com

Quote:

the old list never has an expiration date. It naturally expires on the day the new one gets certified whenever that is.

This is NOT true. HRD has a "three year kill policy." A list will normally be revoked three years after it is established, whether a new list is certified or not. The revocation process is explained in the civil service section of http://www.policelegal.com

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