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Out Of State Dealer Plates

(Click here to view the original thread on the MassCops Message Board)

Posted by: Badge

I have a fairly good idea of the answer, but this would help me out if someone knew for sure.

- Does a MA resident have the right to permanantly operate a vehicle on out of state Dealer plates?

- Would 90/3 apply in this situation, forcing them to properly register?

- What state's laws would we go by to show abuse and is it enforceable in MA?

-What moron thought it was a good idea to allow dealers "unlimted personal use" in MA? (Rhetorical)

In one situation(I have a few) the resident is using a ME dealer plate on a Merz Util, and the dealership it comes back to is a Mobile Home dealership, and the vehicle shows no sign of being for sale.


Posted by: USMCTrooper

I dealt with this issue several years back when I spotted a Florida dealer plate on a Harley during the summer months. The answer then from the RMV was this, Massachusetts dealers have unlimited access (within parameters of law) and by reciprocity can operate in other states. Therefore, we honor other states. So unless you can prove the vehicle being operated is not for sale in the respective state, being operated in violation of the respective state's law re: dealer plates; or otherwise illegally being used under the respective states law, forget it. Its almost an insurmountable burden to overcome. Many dealers set up shop in more lenient states than Massachusetts but live here. The best you can do is call someone in that state and tip them off about possible fraud or abuse.

Maybe this will help put it in perspective.


Posted by: Badge

It does put it in perspective a bit, but at the same time it's still an out of state registration in control of a permanant resident.

I'm going to pursue it via 90/3 and 90/3.5 and if it gets tossed then so be it... We have a departmental "Out Of State Registered, MA Resident" warning that we toss on windshields if they are observed in our city for an extended period of time. I'll start with one of those and see where it goes.


Posted by: lawdog671

It does put it in perspective a bit, but at the same time it's still an out of state registration in control of a permanant resident.
Youre assuming that this person is non compliant with the issuing states laws right?? Because MGL wouldn't apply to them as long as he's in conformance there. This person may be a MA resident but they may own a business in that state so it could be legal...
I'm going to pursue it via 90/3 and 90/3.5 and if it gets tossed then so be it...
Please don't do it if you're not sure....attitudes like that make bad case law for us...plus it's a waste of everyone's time from the judge to the clerk and YOU more importantly.
And if you do choose to cite, I think that you need to be looking under 90/5 that deals specifically with general registrations such as dealer, repair, farm plates etc...not sure if you're reading 90/3 or 90/3 1/2 in the same way I read it. Just a suggestion.


Posted by: USMCTrooper

Quote:
Originally Posted by Badge View Post
It does put it in perspective a bit, but at the same time it's still an out of state registration in control of a permanant resident.

I'm going to pursue it via 90/3 and 90/3.5 and if it gets tossed then so be it... We have a departmental "Out Of State Registered, MA Resident" warning that we toss on windshields if they are observed in our city for an extended period of time. I'll start with one of those and see where it goes.

I agree with Lawdog. Unless you KNOW, dont do it just to see if it gets tossed. You'll lose without so much as a fight. These are complex enough where unless you hand feed the info to the court, they wont grasp it. I've had Judges take my info during the hearing, go back in chambers and look it up, then come back out and ask me questions. 90-5 only details Sec 5 plates. The enforcement comes from 540 CMR 18.00 (mostly sub sections 4-6).


Posted by: Badge

Youre assuming that this person is non compliant with the issuing states laws right??

No, because Maine's laws are not at all specific, they are most likely in compliance with their dealer plate in Maine.

And if you do choose to cite, I think that you need to be looking under 90/5 that deals specifically with general registrations such as dealer, repair, farm plates etc...not sure if you're reading 90/3 or 90/3 1/2 in the same way I read it. Just a suggestion.

Because I believe they are in compliance I don't believe that 90/5 is justified. 90/3 and 3.5 deal with out of state registration and establishing residency. Because they are clearly a resident and have an out of state plates, 90/3 would be perfect.

When I said before "if it gets tossed so be it", I meant it in a different way than I wasn't sure what to charge so I'd try that one. I meant it in that when I ticket for unregistered, 90% of the time they are found not responsible if they have corrected the issue by the time of their hearing. This might not go forward in a similar manner, but I know that 90/3 is a valid charge, failure to register past 30 days as a resident. It is impossible for ME, or any other state for that matter, to issue a plate that is not subject to any laws in another state.


Posted by: lawdog671

Thanks USMC I meant to include the CMR and got distracted.

When I said before "if it gets tossed so be it", I meant it in a different way than I wasn't sure what to charge so I'd try that one. I meant it in that when I ticket for unregistered, 90% of the time they are found not responsible if they have corrected the issue by the time of their hearing. This might not go forward in a similar manner, but I know that 90/3 is a valid charge, failure to register past 30 days as a resident. It is impossible for ME, or any other state for that matter, to issue a plate that is not subject to any laws in another state.
When you're citing 90-9...you're speaking of a MA car not in compliance with MA laws...not a ME dealer plate issue....so whatver the court does you properly cited them under 90-9 and then the courts do as they will..knowing that I usually issue the warning since the tow fees suck and I realize court won't do anything anyways.....but you admitted they're in compliance in ME, and you're not talking about a personally registered car like if the guy has ME passenger car plates attached..they are general registrations...if they were PC plates I would agree not properly registered....but I just don't see you having a leg to stand on...and from what I see in 90-3...3 1/2.. (from 90-3..)
Except as provided in the preceding paragraph, a motor vehicle or trailer, owned by a non-resident, that is in the possession or under the control of a resident of this commonwealth for a period greater than thirty days, in the aggregate within a calendar year, whether under terms of a lease, or otherwise, and such vehicle is registered in another state or country, shall not be operated on the ways of this commonwealth, unless registered under this chapter. Whoever operates or allows to be operated a motor vehicle or trailer in violation of this paragraph, shall be punished by a fine of not less than one hundred nor more than two hundred fifty dollars.
I am of the opinion it doesn't apply...and if you were certain and confident with your charges you wouldn't have sought out opinions here...just saying...but you're a big boy....do what you will. I'm curious to see how it works out for you, good luck.


Posted by: kwflatbed

A little insight to this, I attend car and truck auctions and buy for an out of state dealer.
We went to the registry to find out about the use of out of state dealer plates in MA for
transportation after purchase, the dealer is in AK and if I only purchase one or two cars
they need to go to storage until we have at least six to transport.
The registry said it was 100% legal to use the plates in MA as long as they were not
permantly attached to the car or truck, and we were not using them for personal use
and I was acting as an agent for the company.
We do not have a dealership or sell the cars and trucks in MA so we do not
qualify for MA dealer plates.


Posted by: USMCTrooper

Quote:
Originally Posted by lawdog671 View Post
Except as provided in the preceding paragraph, a motor vehicle or trailer, owned by a non-resident, that is in the possession or under the control of a resident of this commonwealth for a period greater than thirty days, in the aggregate within a calendar year, whether under terms of a lease, or otherwise, and such vehicle is registered in another state or country, shall not be operated on the ways of this commonwealth, unless registered under this chapter. Whoever operates or allows to be operated a motor vehicle or trailer in violation of this paragraph, shall be punished by a fine of not less than one hundred nor more than two hundred fifty dollars.

That says it all. The VEHICLE is NOT registered anywhere, period. I guarantee you if you run the VIN it will not come back to that Maine dealer plate. It doesn't have to. Neither does a vehicle with a Massachusetts dealer plate. Be careful is all I think we are saying....in Massachusetts there are exceptions to unlimited use of a dealer plate. Maine is a reciprocity state with Massachusetts.


Posted by: Badge

Quote:
Originally Posted by USMCTrooper View Post
That says it all. The VEHICLE is NOT registered anywhere, period. I guarantee you if you run the VIN it will not come back to that Maine dealer plate. It doesn't have to. Neither does a vehicle with a Massachusetts dealer plate. Be careful is all I think we are saying....in Massachusetts there are exceptions to unlimited use of a dealer plate. Maine is a reciprocity state with Massachusetts.
(From 90/5)(c) Unless prohibited by this chapter or any rule or regulation of the registry, any motor vehicle or trailer owned or controlled by any person who has been issued a general distinguishing registration number which properly displays the valid corresponding general registration number plate shall be regarded as registered under this chapter; provided however, that no motor vehicle or trailer so registered shall be loaned or let for hire for more than five consecutive days.

Therefor if you want to reference reciprocity, the vehicle is registered in ME.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kwflatbed
The registry said it was 100% legal to use the plates in MA as long as they were not
permantly attached to the car or truck, and we were not using them for personal use
and I was acting as an agent for the company.
So, based on that alone one would assume that if someone were using an out of state dealer plate on a vehicle for personal use it would be a violation. I'm just curious what violation they were referencing by noting that.


Posted by: kwflatbed

They did not cite chapter and verse but I would think the "personal use"
gives someone a wide berth in using the plate, traveling for both business
or pleasure would be hard to determine which they were doing at the time.


Posted by: Badge

After consulting the legal department of the RMV I was informed that it is citable under 90/3.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RMV Legal
Out-of-state dealers are buying and selling motor vehicles at auctions in MA every day and transporting them out of state or reselling them at the auctions. MA dealers do the same in other states. The out-of-state dealer may be employing MA residents who are provided with the out-of-state dealer's plate in order to transport the vehicles to and from the auctions. However, the MA resident should not be using the Dealer Plate on a vehicle that is regularly being used whether for business or personal use. Chapter 90, Section 3 is certainly relevant here. ... You also stated that the vehicle has been in the Commonwealth for more than 30 days. Therefore, the vehicle is clearly in the possession or under the control of a "resident" of this Commonwealth.



Posted by: CivilServiceNO1Fan

I think you might want to check into Maine Title 29-A for this. The law in Maine is at least somewhat restrictive based upon the operator's title at the dealership and intent with the vehicle.


Posted by: mpd61

How bout this one?:

Ma Motorcycle DLR Plate on a Subaru AWD wagon? Seen it twice on 27 in Walpole/Sharon area!



Posted by: lawdog671

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpd61 View Post
How bout this one?:

Ma Motorcycle DLR Plate on a Subaru AWD wagon? Seen it twice on 27 in Walpole/Sharon area!
As long as its for sale and they operator is qualified then it's legal...looks stupid with the tiny little plate though huh???


Posted by: mpr4601

Looks as silly as a full size dealer plate on a motorcylce (seen that too, had to look twice!)


Posted by: PapaBear

Here is the law for California.

Quote:
Operation With Special Plates: Exceptions

11715. (a) A manufacturer, remanufacturer, distributor, or dealer owning or lawfully possessing any vehicle of a type otherwise required to be registered under this code may operate or move the vehicle upon the highways without registering the vehicle upon condition that the vehicle displays special plates issued to the owner as provided in this chapter, in addition to other license plates or permits already assigned and attached to the vehicle in the manner prescribed in Sections 5200 to 5203, inclusive. A vehicle for sale or lease by a dealer may also be operated or moved upon the highways without registration for a period not to exceed seven days by a prospective buyer or lessee who is test-driving the vehicle for possible purchase or lease, if the vehicle is in compliance with this condition. The vehicle may also be moved or operated for the purpose of towing or transporting by any lawful method other vehicles.
(b) A transporter may operate or move any owned or lawfully possessed vehicle of like type by any lawful method upon the highways solely for the purpose of delivery, upon condition that there be displayed upon each vehicle in contact with the highway special license plates issued to the transporter as provided in this chapter, in addition to any license plates or permits already assigned and attached to the vehicle in the manner prescribed in Sections 5200 to 5203, inclusive. The vehicles may be used for the purpose of towing or transporting by any lawful method other vehicles when the towing or transporting vehicle is being delivered for sale or to the owner thereof.
(c) This section does not apply to any manufacturer, remanufacturer, transporter, distributor, or dealer operating or moving a vehicle as provided in Section 11716.
(d) This section does not apply to work or service vehicles owned by a manufacturer, remanufacturer, transporter, distributor, or dealer. This section does not apply to vehicles owned and leased by dealers, except those vehicles rented or leased to vehicle salespersons in the course of their employment for purposes of display or demonstration, nor to any unregistered vehicles used to transport more than one load of other vehicles for the purpose of sale.
(e) This section does not apply to vehicles currently registered in this state that are owned and operated by a licensed dealer when the notice of transfer has been forwarded to the department by the former owner of record pursuant to Section 5900 and when a copy of the notice is displayed as follows:
(1) For a motorcycle or motor-driven cycle, the notice is displayed in a conspicuous manner upon the vehicle.
(2) For a vehicle other than a motorcycle or motor-driven cycle, the notice is displayed in the lower right-hand corner of the windshield of the vehicle, as specified in paragraph (3) of subdivision (b) of Section 26708.
(f) Every owner, upon receipt of a registration card issued for special plates, shall maintain the same or a facsimile copy thereof with the vehicle bearing the special plates.

Amended Sec. 6.5, Ch. 739, Stats. 2001. Effective January 1, 2002.
Needless to say, if you see a vehicle with CA dealer, manufacturer or distributor plates driving in your area, you may sieze the plates and take the appropriate enforcement action for your state - which may include impounding the vehicle. CA special plates are invalid outside of CA. A few dealers have learned their lessons the hard way when traveling into NV and AZ.


Posted by: The_Doctor

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpd61 View Post
How bout this one?:

Ma Motorcycle DLR Plate on a Subaru AWD wagon? Seen it twice on 27 in Walpole/Sharon area!
The large issue in these situations has to be a lack of sales tax compliance. They have to pay for insurance in order to get dealer plates. The insurance is considerably more expensive than other forms of car insurance.

They only save on sales tax. Only employees of a dealer should be driving the vehicle. A person that does not work for the dealership should not be driving it.

The DOR Commissioner has promulgated a regulation which allows them to pay sales tax on a portion of the value of the vehicle each month, directly. This means that a car dealer can have a car for a 6 months and pay a pittance in sales tax.

I have seen a number of cars, which are solely being used as take home cars. I have not seen any repair plates being used for transportation at these dealerships or repair shops.

Bill


Posted by: Harley387

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpd61 View Post
How bout this one?:

Ma Motorcycle DLR Plate on a Subaru AWD wagon? Seen it twice on 27 in Walpole/Sharon area!
My understanding of the law on this (Per Det. Scesny) is that a motorcycle dealer plate may only be used on a vehicle with 2 wheels. I can't find anything in MGL to back that up though.


Posted by: USMCTrooper

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harley387 View Post
My understanding of the law on this (Per Det. Scesny) is that a motorcycle dealer plate may only be used on a vehicle with 2 wheels. I can't find anything in MGL to back that up though.

No. If you are a licensed dealer in Massachusetts (since thats where we live) and you hold Dealer plates AND motorcycle dealer plates, you can use them on your vehicle inventory interchangeably. To get both type of plates from the RMV you obviously have to meet the legal criteria but I have seen the tiny plates on vehicles. It looks odd but as long as the plate is valid, displayed properly, etc etc etc. they're good.


I have my entire folder on Section 5 plates & CMR 18.00 in hard copy form so PM me if anyone wants it faxed out.


Posted by: 209

Instead of charging the person and seeing if it gets tossed go to the court and talk to the Clerk Magistrate. They will determine PC anyways. Thats what I do if I'm not sure. Usually they say bring the complaint, sometimes they say don't.




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