| I see the Middlesex Transport guys every once in a while, and they all see like decent guys. The question is, do you want to get into police work, or head into corrections. Both are noble fields in Law Enforcement, but both have extremely different roles. |
| Originally Posted by Sab21  Well the college I work out of is not armed (we do have OC and Baton) and it is more security work then police work (I would say 90% security and 10% law enforcement). It's not really what the Administration made it out to be during my interviews and background investigation. I do aspire to be a Municipal Police Officer. But the way the civil service system works, its real hard if your not a veteran. |
| Originally Posted by rocksy1826 they can advise you... but i think you meant to ask for advice |
(just bustin)
| Originally Posted by mpd61 Very helpful you flatulent feminine fool! (just bustin) |
| Originally Posted by sherifflittle mine smells like an edible arrangement..the big kind |
| Originally Posted by sherifflittle mine smells like an edible arrangement..the big kind |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 I personally feel as though the veterans are giving way too much preference when it comes to CS tests. What about the kids that goes onto college and pays a boat load of money on student loans, etc...? I've known plenty of retards who had no direction in life after they graduated high school, join the Marines or another branch of service for 4 yrs and come out and land a law enforcement job with ease. What about the kid who pays money for an education, put in more effort, and can typically portray effective communication with the public? Not only should a college grad get receive more money via the Quin Bill, but they are the ones who should be getting the additional preference from the Civil Service. I am not knocking the military in general, as my father is a retired Marine and my brother is a former Marine. They have my utmost respect for what they do...however, I just do not feel they should receive the special treatment that they currently do. As for the post, these guys have given you some good advice. Either avenue is a great one. Good luck! |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 I personally feel as though the veterans are giving way too much preference when it comes to CS tests. What about the kids that goes onto college and pays a boat load of money on student loans, etc...? I've known plenty of retards who had no direction in life after they graduated high school, join the Marines or another branch of service for 4 yrs and come out and land a law enforcement job with ease. What about the kid who pays money for an education, put in more effort, and can typically portray effective communication with the public? Not only should a college grad get receive more money via the Quin Bill, but they are the ones who should be getting the additional preference from the Civil Service. I am not knocking the military in general, as my father is a retired Marine and my brother is a former Marine. They have my utmost respect for what they do...however, I just do not feel they should receive the special treatment that they currently do. As for the post, these guys have given you some good advice. Either avenue is a great one. Good luck! |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 You're both correct, I did not serve in the military because I had my own personal goals in furthering my education. I am simply stating that it is not fair to the kid who decides to go to college and has the goal of becoming a law enforcement officer, but loses out to another individual because he chose to join the armed forces. . |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 The bottom line is we all put our lives on the line now...I don't feel as though I deserve any extra anything than the next successful civilian. . |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 The bottom line is when it comes to taking a test for a job...the civil service should taken the top scores. PERIOD. Regardless if the person is a Vet, has a Masters Degree, or is a Minority. At any rate, lets end this conversation. I do salute the Veterans and appreciate the Military in general, as I do my fellow LEO. Take care. |
| Originally Posted by USMCMP5811 No! the bottom line is that the VET put his ass on the line LONG before the civilian. |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 I personally feel as though the veterans are giving way too much preference when it comes to CS tests. What about the kids that goes onto college and pays a boat load of money on student loans, etc...? I've known plenty of retards who had no direction in life after they graduated high school, join the Marines or another branch of service for 4 yrs and come out and land a law enforcement job with ease. What about the kid who pays money for an education, put in more effort, and can typically portray effective communication with the public? Not only should a college grad get receive more money via the Quin Bill, but they are the ones who should be getting the additional preference from the Civil Service. I am not knocking the military in general, as my father is a retired Marine and my brother is a former Marine. They have my utmost respect for what they do...however, I just do not feel they should receive the special treatment that they currently do. As for the post, these guys have given you some good advice. Either avenue is a great one. Good luck! |
| Originally Posted by kwflatbed Sounds like you didn't serve your country like your father and brother did in the military either. I salute them for their service. Veterans deserve everything that they get period. |
| Originally Posted by USMCMP5811 Well, if they were smart, they should have joined the military and gotten some of the education incentives like the GI Bill to help off set the cost of their high priced education. Like Harry said, sounds like you never served in the Military. Vets deserve every break they can get because what they paid for in education ment putting their lives on the line, not Daddys wallet. |
| Originally Posted by redsox03 Ditto. |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 I had my own personal goals |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 You're both correct, I did not serve in the military because I had my own personal goals in furthering my education. I am simply stating that it is not fair to the kid who decides to go to college and has the goal of becoming a law enforcement officer, but loses out to another individual because he chose to join the armed forces. Regardless who pays for college whether it may be the student themselves or "daddy," that's irrelevant to my point. I was lucky enough to have earned a baseball scholarship to pay for my tuition...let me tell you that was a full-time job in itself. My father could not have afforded to pay for my full school costs. The bottom line is we all put our lives on the line now...I don't feel as though I deserve any extra anything than the next successful civilian. The bottom line is when it comes to taking a test for a job...the civil service should taken the top scores. PERIOD. Regardless if the person is a Vet, has a Masters Degree, or is a Minority. At any rate, lets end this conversation. I do salute the Veterans and appreciate the Military in general, as I do my fellow LEO. Take care. |
| Originally Posted by Sab21 I am a 23-year-old Campus Police Officer; I have a BS in Criminal Justice from Salem State. I recently just started as a Campus Police Officer, and received a job offer from Middlesex county Sheriffs Dept. to start there Academy this February. Basically I am trying to make a decision as to stay where I am or to take the job with Middlesex (Middlesex does pay a great deal more). Can anyone from Middlesex County tell me how the job is? Is there high morale? Is there a lot of opportunity to advance? |
| Originally Posted by AdamJ1984 After being an advocate for the college and the best man/woman for the job route, I have slowly shifted over to the Veteran's edge side. These men and women bust their asses not only physically, but I think most importantly mentally to protect this land. It has inspired me so much to think about joining, not full on but on a reserve, NG level, but if called to duty, wouldn't blink an eye. I have an OT question, I know there is a listing of what the state defines as Veteran's Preference, but what would I have to do to earn it? I was thinking about the position of MP or security forces, but do you have to be sent to a conflict zone, I know some of the NG has been sent to Kosovo, but is that a peace mission? |
| Originally Posted by Killjoy Veterans protect the college student's right to go to college....that's why they earn every advantage we can give them. I doubt sitting in frat house, shotgunning beer, and going to 2pm classes bleary eyed can compare to a combat tour. The college student risks nothing more than a case of crabs from the local dorm ho, while the vet risks his life every day in the AOR! |
The Tomb of the Unknown Soldier,
It was the Veteran,| Originally Posted by USMCMP5811 If I remember correctly, as a member of the NG, you must serve 180 days on active duty( doesn't matter where so long as it is not a school) and you will be granted Vet status. |
| Originally Posted by BartA1 Non Vet here. If after risking life or limb in service to the USA I think the least civil service can do is give returning veterans some preference on a civil service test. If you dont like the system in Mass try to change it, or find another state that does things differently, or if you are physically able to serve step up to the plate. |
| Originally Posted by pahapoika i'd personally take the Middlesex job. you'll get to inter-act with the criminal element, get your hands dirty and make more money with benefits. keep taking the tests , get your intermittent academy , work part time for a PD and hope you get lucky. if not and 10 years goes by you'll be half way to a pension and retirement. as far as the vet's go , i have no problem with someone coming home and getting in line before me. |
| Originally Posted by USMCMP5811 So your saying that, the person who has the degree, should get the job over a Vet? ***ABSOLUTELY*** No! the bottom line is that the VET put his ass on the line LONG before the civilian. Yes, we may both put our ases on the line now, but, the VET has been doing it long before coming on this job. Us Vets are more than just a successfull civilian. ***Yes, during war time only. Otherwise, a soldier is drinking himself into oblivion at a local far and being obnovious. The difference between a college student, is that he has a 2000% better chance of getting laid. Also, a lot of potential military candidates either have horrible grades and cannot get into a real college, or join just because they need money to go to school, since recruiters do typically go after teenagers from low-income families. Sure as hell doesn't sound like it. sounds more like back peddling to me. |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 Would you feel the same way if it wasn't war time? |
| Originally Posted by USMCMP5811 If I remember correctly, as a member of the NG, you must serve 180 days on active duty( doesn't matter where so long as it is not a school) and you will be granted Vet status. Good lluck with your future endevours. Well said Brother, well said. Just to add The Tomb of the Unknown Soldier,A Veteran's Resting Place, Arlington Cemetary Remember It was the Veteran, Not the reporter, Who has given us freedom of the press. It was the Veteran, Not the poet, Who has given us freedom of speech. It was the Veteran, Not the lawyer, Who has given us the right to a fair trial. It was the Veteran, Not the police, Who has given us the right to be secure in our persons. It was the Veteran, Not the campus organizer, Who has given us the right to demonstrate. It is the Veteran, Not the politician, Who defends our Nation It is the Veteran, Who salutes the flag. Who served under the flag. Who gave his oath to support and defend The Constitution and Our Nation Against all Enemies, Foreign and Domestic It is the Veteran, Willing to give his life to protect your freedoms and mine. Whose coffin is draped by the flag. It was the Veteran,With faith in God Who has given us all our Freedoms. |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 I also feel as though an education has an edge on preparing a candidate for a LE position. |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 I ended up getting a baseball scholarship and that honestly made me realize what "teamwork" and "sacrifice" was all about. Playing at that level was like a full time job itself, plus taking classes. |
| I ended up getting a baseball scholarship and that honestly made me realize what "teamwork" and "sacrifice" was all about. |
| The reason why I brought up war time is because how would these guys be sacrificing their lives for me if we weren't at war? |
| Originally Posted by Killjoy There's a huge difference between sacrificing your free afternoons for baseball practice and possibly sacrificing you life, well being, and comrades. If you can't see the difference then you're, quite frankly, a fool. Members of the armed services sacrifice their lives whether we are at war or peace. They deal with powerful, dangerous machinery and weapons, and frequently are killed or injured in accidents. For a seaman serving aboard an aircraft carrier, one of the most cramped, dangerous workspaces in the world, it really makes no difference if their birds are dropping bombs or not, its still the same job. Whether its "combat" or "training", thirty-ton planes are rocketing off the deck mere feet from you. You do it in bad weather, night and no matter how tired you are. Soldiers and Marines training in the field run around at night, go days without sleeping, eat crap food, rappel out of helicopters, jump out of airplanes, and amphibiously assault beaches. Many times they are injured or killed in during training, because they are doing things civilians wouldn't think of, and would probably make OSHA sh*t their pants to look at. Think a tank is loud, and would be easy to avoid on foot? Then run around one at night, short on sleep, with the tanks buzzing by at 40mph. Think you're a strong swimmer? Try swimming in the ice-cold north Atlantic water while burdened with a rifle, body armor and sixty pounds of equipment. How about being nineteen years old and having 50 million dollar aircraft flown by captains and majors being directed by you onto targets in the pitch black with one wrong move and you've just killed an aircrew. How about being that pilot flying at 400 knots through mountains, in the dark depending on young kid out there to give you the right coordinates. But the military cannot train more "safely", it is up to the military to train as realistically as possible, so when the time comes to put the metal to the meat, it is second nature to the soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines. Anything less would be a disservice to our fighting men. This is in addition to the familial stress that service life entails, even in peace. Low pay, frequent moves, and long absences are the rule. I should know, my father spent twenty years in the Air Force, with a one year tour in Vietnam. He also happened to earn a bachelors and masters degree when he was in. I spent five years in the Air Force, with a tour to the Persian Gulf during Desert Shield/Desert Storm, along with tour to Korea and another rotation to the Persian AOR in the mid nineties. I earned a bachelors after I got out, but that was peanuts in comparison with my military service. Since only a very small number of Americans choose to serve in the military, placing themselves between our country and our nations enemies, I feel it is the least we can do to give them some compensation for their hard work. Some points on a test for public service, for which they have already stepped up to the plate on, is not a burden on the rest of society, who benefits enormously from their service. Sorry to have hijacked this post...I'll step off my soapbox now. |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 I ended up getting a baseball scholarship and that honestly made me realize what "teamwork" and "sacrifice" was all about. Playing at that level was like a full time job itself, plus taking classes. |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 I'm just rebutting to others' comments that I'm seeing now, not really trying to take this to the next level. Too Late. If I had to do it all over again, I would still choose to go to college and earn my degree, without even thinking twice. I ended up getting a baseball scholarship and that honestly made me realize what "teamwork" and "sacrifice" was all about. Playing at that level was like a full time job itself, plus taking classes. Sacrafice? Sacrafise???? Are you F'in shitting me? Let's see how well you fair working 18-20 hours a day, 7 days a week. Working holidays, kids birthdays, wedding aniverserys, and being deployed away from your family for a year or more at a time. This is even in peace time. All of that with out overtime and for $784 dollars a month. Yes, I said A MONTH. I used this once before but, I think it needs to be reiterated because I can think of no better way to say it. Son, we live in a world that has walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. Whose gonna do it? You? You, MM7918? I have a greater responsibility than you could possibly fathom. You weep for no Vet Preferance, and you curse the Marines. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives. You don't want the truth because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that wall, you need me on that wall. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to. And no thanks pal, I already earned my postion going on 9 years with the Marshals Service... Couldn't get on a municipal or state police huh? I see why your still bitter at Vet preferance now...... The reason why I brought up war time is because how would these guys be sacrificing their lives for me if we weren't at war? |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 If I had to do it all over again, I would still choose to go to college and earn my degree, without even thinking twice. I ended up getting a baseball scholarship and that honestly made me realize what "teamwork" and "sacrifice" was all about. Playing at that level was like a full time job itself, plus taking classes. And no thanks pal, I already earned my postion going on 9 years with the Marshals Service... The reason why I brought up war time is because how would these guys be sacrificing their lives for me if we weren't at war? |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 I ended up getting a baseball scholarship and that honestly made me realize what "teamwork" and "sacrifice" was all about. |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 And no thanks pal, I already earned my postion going on 9 years with the Marshals Service... |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 The reason why I brought up war time is because how would these guys be sacrificing their lives for me if we weren't at war? |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 I'm just rebutting to others' comments that I'm seeing now, not really trying to take this to the next level. If I had to do it all over again, I would still choose to go to college and earn my degree, without even thinking twice. I ended up getting a baseball scholarship and that honestly made me realize what "teamwork" and "sacrifice" was all about. Playing at that level was like a full time job itself, plus taking classes. And no thanks pal, I already earned my postion going on 9 years with the Marshals Service... The reason why I brought up war time is because how would these guys be sacrificing their lives for me if we weren't at war? |
| Originally Posted by MM7918 I'm just rebutting to others' comments that I'm seeing now, not really trying to take this to the next level. If I had to do it all over again, I would still choose to go to college and earn my degree, without even thinking twice. I ended up getting a baseball scholarship and that honestly made me realize what "teamwork" and "sacrifice" was all about. Playing at that level was like a full time job itself, plus taking classes. And no thanks pal, I already earned my postion going on 9 years with the Marshals Service... The reason why I brought up war time is because how would these guys be sacrificing their lives for me if we weren't at war? |
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