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Campus Unions

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Posted by: 5-0

Looking for some PMs from anyone experienced in getting a union onto campus, as well as reputable unions for private schools. Thanks!


Posted by: rg1283

AFSCME, no way!


Posted by: LAWPD79

I 2nd RG AFSCME sux!!! go with a legit police union, AFSCME should be strictley just a housekeepers union


Posted by: 5-0

I am pretty sure AFSCME was out of the question anyhow, seeing that we are a private school.


Posted by: mpr4601

Definitely stay away from SEIU, another cafeteria worker/janitor union (nothing against those jobs, but it's just not a police union). A place I worked at years ago was in it, they suck!


Posted by: union1

If your a private college which if your asking this you probly are. Your best bet unless you have a good 60 guys is to not even bother.

I come with YEARS of expirence and expirence in forming a union at Emerson. I am telling you the college has FAR more money then you guys collectively ever have to spend. Your also under the Taft Hartly act which prohibits you from going into any union that also has laborers which means you need to find a strictly security guard union.

I strongly say dont bother.

On the other hand your administration might like to bargain, give up their power over your jobs and allow you to govern the way you work. I doubit it though.


Posted by: infocop

many of the major colleges have gone the way of a private labor attorney, there are several great ones out there. most go on a yearly retainer which will get you a predetermined number of hours, when you go over those hours it can add up. if you have a good size dept (30+ patrol) you should do fine. they are worth it because they are communicating between eachother to find out what other college cops get for pay and bennies.


Posted by: Kilvinsky

start out as an "association". Look into a labor attorney to represent your "association" and in time, maybe you can petition a union. There's a few of them out there in addition to the IBPO, to which I belong. Some of the newer smaller unions would love to scoop up new groups, but Union1 is somewhat right, if you've only got a handful of guys, it might be more work than it's worth, but ask around, you never know. Don't give up until you've exhausted all the possibilities.


Posted by: 5-0

Thanks for the info guys. We are floating around 25 officers, so we'll see who is interested in talking to us.


Posted by: Kilvinsky

25 is a good number. RUN with it, but make sure you have everyone on board. One or two 'not sures' can kill the whole thing before it's had a real chance.

Best of Luck!


Posted by: union1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilvinsky
start out as an "association". Look into a labor attorney to represent your "association" and in time, maybe you can petition a union. There's a few of them out there in addition to the IBPO, to which I belong. Some of the newer smaller unions would love to scoop up new groups, but Union1 is somewhat right, if you've only got a handful of guys, it might be more work than it's worth, but ask around, you never know. Don't give up until you've exhausted all the possibilities.
Somewhat?... I am... Ive formed a "private" association and went as far as I can go. I cannot stress enough, Taft Hartley act will kill your attempts. Private college police are considred Guards under that act and they connot legaly be represented by any organization that represents laborers. This does in effect kill all of the major unions out there "AFL CIO" as representatives.

The only successful private union that I have ever herd that is or was at one time actualy breaking the law is Suffolk being in cahoots with the Teamsters. Suffolk chose to recognize the Teamsters from what I understand of the arrangement. Dont count on this situation repeating itself.

We chose to go with an "association" and had Alan McDonald represent us. Alan is a top rate attorney who did a GREAT job with the chips he was given. He represented 11 guys against the biggest union busting law firm in the state "Foley and Hoag" and came out with no egg on his face. The union disbanded when I left the department I believe mainly because noone was passionate about getting a contract after something like 5 years of Negotiations.

One other thing, to the guys over at Northeastern... If Janet Fuckner is still there representing the school. Give her the finger for me and tell I hapily asked you to give it to her.


Posted by: mpd61

Quote:
Originally Posted by 5-0
Looking for some PMs from anyone experienced in getting a union onto campus, as well as reputable unions for private schools. Thanks!
Hey Rob!

Take it easy dude! Kilvinsky was agreeing with you for the most part. Maybe you could keep some of your anger in the PM's as requested.



Posted by: UnlawfulDesign

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpd61
Hey Rob!

Take it easy dude! Kilvinsky was agreeing with you for the most part. Maybe you could keep some of your anger in the PM's as requested.


Am I missing something here????


Posted by: union1

Unlaw - Just my nemesis doing what he does best... Trying to fire me up

MPD61 - Nothing on this board gets me even agitated never mind angry. I just want to make sure any new union is not doomed from the start by a technicality.


Quote:
Originally Posted by UnlawfulDesign
Am I missing something here????



Posted by: Kilvinsky

Quote:
Originally Posted by union1
Unlaw - Just my nemesis doing what he does best... Trying to fire me up
Geez, I hope you don't mean me. I don't want to be anyone's nemesis (well no one outside my department) I WAS agreeing with you. I've been in a union for over 27 years, even doing two very unimpressive stints as Secretary (of two different unions-two different dept.s). I know the problems you guys had and think it was disgraceful how the college behaved.

The biggest problem facing a college police union that is trying to get started is that most of the people who take the job do not see themselves as staying very long. The stepping stone mentality. I don't fault them for this, I had it once. The other group is the retirees who figure their pension is safe so if they're treated poorly, they'll just quit. What happens is, you'll have a core group fighting like the dickens for what is right. The institution will fight back (sometimes dirty, sometimes just sneaky) and then, BOOM, a few extra bucks and maybe a few toys will be thrown at everyone based on the contingency that the whole union business be just shoo'd away. The guys with no long term plans will say, "hey, I'm living for the moment, I'LL TAKE THE MONEY!"

You lose your solidarity, hence, the door is cracked open and the institution wins. All you need is to lose a few guys and it's a dead issue. The ironic thing is when these very guys find themselves staying. OOPS, you screwed yourself, didn't you?

You know this. The people who would benefit from a union are often their own worst enemies.

I was agreeing with you. If my wording caused you some consternation, my apologies


Posted by: Edmizer1

Be prepared for dirty politics if you start a private campus union. These colleges don't have to follow certain public agency practices and can hide the amount of money that they spend on lawyers. The campuses are all liberal places and want to make sure that they have total control over the campus police. I used to work at a large private campus pd and once my chief told me that the campus had a ton of money and the union would never win a particular issue because the school would spend them into the ground.


Posted by: OutOfManyOne

So go with a big union like Teamsters that can back them up financially and block the entrances with the big rigs.


Posted by: firefighter39

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutOfManyOne
So go with a big union like Teamsters that can back them up financially and block the entrances with the big rigs.

Any union is only as good as the members at the local level regardless of how big the parent union is. Wether it is SEIU, Temasters, AFL-CIO, EIEIO unless you local members have some backbone it won't matter

If you work with a bunch of asswipes that won't stand behind their brothers(sisters) then you local is impotent and unable to perform.


Posted by: new guy

Quote:
Originally Posted by firefighter39
Any union is only as good as the members at the local level regardless of how big the parent union is. Wether it is SEIU, Temasters, AFL-CIO, EIEIO unless you local members have some backbone it won't matter

If you work with a bunch of asswipes that won't stand behind their brothers(sisters) then you local is impotent and unable to perform.
Fortunately you could take a pill for that. It worked for smiling Bob.


Posted by: Kilvinsky

Quote:
Originally Posted by new guy
Fortunately you could take a pill for that. It worked for smiling Bob.
Yeah, but lack of a 'backBONE' wasn't Smilin' Bob's problem.


Posted by: PROUD2BFOP

As other post have said, a good option would be to create an association and hire a good labor attorney that will deal with contracts negotiations etc. Then also get all your members signed onto a Legal Plan. The Fraternal Order of Police Legal Plan will cover your members for all criminal, civil and administartive matter for only $197.00 per year. They have paid up to $100,000 in legal fees to defense a cop and that cop only paid $197! It's a great option considering you really don't need an attorney all the time, just mainly during contract negotiations.

Northeastern University all joined the FOP and they have the protection of the legal plan. They actually formed the Boston area Campus Police Lodge so you wouldn't have to have your own group to get the coverage.

Check out the Massachusett FOP web site at www.massfop.org for more information. The web site is being updated so it may be down for a short time. Feel free to call the state lodge at (50 844-1221 and they will ship you out information.

Even if you don't join for the legal plan, joining the FOP either individually or as a department it is a great deal. There are some great benefits to joining the largest police organization in the country (325,000 strong!) All members of law enforcement are welcome. AS long as syou are a full time law enforcement officer you qualify to become a member.


Posted by: dgold127

Strap on your seat belts! This is my first time posting to this site and I'm hoping it allows me to "rally the troops". I recently left a municipal police department and took a job at one of the larger colleges in Boston. I couldn't believe how bad things were union-wise so here is the grand plan.

In the very near future...just a couple of weeks...there will be in existence a powerful, fast-growing union strictly for officers who work for private colleges and universities. This union will have a strong national affiliation with hundreds of thousands of members and strong political clout.

The legal representation that this union will provide will be second to none...and contracts will be negotiated by teams of local members and national representatives.

Imagine finally having a union just for us! Stop imagining...and check back for updates. I'm going away for a few days...hopefully when I get back I'll log on and see a fruitful discussion has taken place on this subject.

If your group is currently considering an affiliation....hold everything!


Posted by: Kilvinsky

That read like an advertisement, but if the product is truly a good one, then GREAT.

I believe BUPD was at one time affiliated with a Railroad Police union. Yeah, I was very surprised myself, but that's what I was told, many moons ago.


Posted by: union1

When I was at Emerson we tried doing this with a guard union. interest fell prety quickly. Good luck if you can make it work, its definitly worth it.


Posted by: 5-0

Quote:
Originally Posted by dgold127 View Post
Strap on your seat belts! This is my first time posting to this site and I'm hoping it allows me to "rally the troops". I recently left a municipal police department and took a job at one of the larger colleges in Boston. I couldn't believe how bad things were union-wise so here is the grand plan.

In the very near future...just a couple of weeks...there will be in existence a powerful, fast-growing union strictly for officers who work for private colleges and universities. This union will have a strong national affiliation with hundreds of thousands of members and strong political clout.

The legal representation that this union will provide will be second to none...and contracts will be negotiated by teams of local members and national representatives.

Imagine finally having a union just for us! Stop imagining...and check back for updates. I'm going away for a few days...hopefully when I get back I'll log on and see a fruitful discussion has taken place on this subject.

If your group is currently considering an affiliation....hold everything!
Thanks for the help folks, I have some info from PM's that has given us some contacts in the area, and we'll be moving forward soon. Feel free to send me a PM dgold when you get your stuff off the ground. Thanks again.


Posted by: GALEWINDS

wow




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