MassCops - Massachusetts Law Enforcement Network, A Mass Police Web Portal

Massachusetts Law Enforcement Network

Massachusetts Police News, Information and Discussions on MassCops

Pages: 1

Main Page Shared police idea floated - Warren/W Brookfield PDs
(Click here to view the original thread on the MassCops Message Board)

Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Wednesday, November 28, 2007

Shared police idea floated

Selectmen suggest one facility, combined force

By J.P. Ellery CORRESPONDENT

WEST BROOKFIELD— It may be a real long shot, but Selectman Barry J. Nadon Jr. is interested in exploring a joint police station and even a combined police force with neighboring Warren.

'“I’d definitely be for looking into it,” Mr. Nadon said yesterday, “but whether it would ever come to fruition or not, I don’t know. I’m interested in anything that’s going to save the town money, as long as it’s feasible.”

West Brookfield voters have approved spending up to $2 million for a new police station. An ad hoc committee is looking for a site to replace the police station, located in Town Hall on Route 9. That building is crowded and lacks room for expansion.

Warren voters last year said OK to discussing a possible lease of a building on Old West Brookfield Road for a police station, but the owners of that structure now are talking of constructing a police station rather that rehabilitating the existing building.

The Warren police station also is located in Town Hall on Main Street, a facility described as inadequate and not expandable.

Warren Selectman Robert W. Souza Jr. agreed with Mr. Nadon that discussing the possibility would be worthwhile, but selling it to local residents will be tough.

“The old-fashioned makeup in this town is awfully hard to get by,” he said. “They just talk about response time and this and that.”

“I’d be willing to explore anything,” Mr. Souza added. “I’m very open-minded to everything. I’m the type of person where I feel that you can’t make a rational decision or an educated decision until you’ve heard everything.”

West Brookfield Selectman Thomas H. Long also said the subject should be given consideration.

“I’d certainly be interested in listening to and discussing it,” he said.

A regional police station or police department presents all kinds of hurdles to overcome, according to Mr. Nadon, not the least of which is a site agreeable to both towns. Building a joint police station either at the Warren town line on Route 67 or near Uncle Sam’s Pizza on Route 9 would place the structure significantly away from the downtown sections of both towns.

Years ago, he said, there was an attempt in West Brookfield to regionalize fire and ambulance services, but “there were too many egos and issues that came up. They didn’t even want to look into it.”

However, West Brookfield Fire Chief Timothy R. Batchelor is on record as favoring a regional fire service, understanding that cost is a key consideration.

Mr. Nadon understands there are lots of things to iron out if the two towns were to get serious about a joint police station and/or joint police department, but it makes sense to check into the possibility while both towns are considering a police facility.

With a joint police department, he said, the town would at least save the salary of a police chief, and state officials have told West Brookfield in the past that money is available for regional ventures of this type.

“I’ve been to other states that do it and they seem to be doing fine,” Mr. Nadon said.

Both towns are lacking a lockup in their police station to confine prisoners. A joint building would enable a larger lockup that could be leased to surrounding towns in the years ahead, Mr. Souza said.

Posted by: jyanis

Not sure a township PD could work in the People's Republic. Are there any Warren/West Brookfield officers on here? What is the feeling in the respected PD's?

Posted by: Edmizer1

Regional policing will come to Massachusetts. Its just a matter of time. Other parts of the country are doing it without any problem with a significant savings. Two things will make it happen. Healthcare costs are straining the municipal budgets and it is projected to get much worse in a few years. In the early 80s there was a municipal budget crisis which created huge pd/fd layoffs. We are due for another crisis. They come about every 15-20 years. If the healthcare costs continue to rise and we hit another budget crunch like the 80s, there's a good chance regional police departments may get formed. I know that many here think that egos will prevent this. Finance people in my town are seriosly talking about a regional dispatch center with a couple of other towns. Regional police has been discussed but not seriously. These people are the ultimate decision makers and they could care less about the egos involved. They do know that they will get a battle when they propose the regional police idea so its essentially dead in this state. As soon as a budget crisis gives them ammo, the idea will come out strong.

Posted by: rg1283

I think it should be looked at in the smaller towns like West Brookfield who run with very few officers on a shift. The farther west you get the less likely you will see enough police officers to back each other up. Regional Policing wouldn't work in a City, however with smaller towns it could work. The problem would lie in, now what would the Chief of Town A do when his town PD is merged into Town B. He is not going to retire, and say forget it.

Dudley Police used to have 15 Officers on, now they 10 Officers (Ft) due to budget cuts, and lay offs. One Officer was quoted saying when he started 20 years ago they had 10 Police Officers working.

Regionalization of dispatch wouldn't save much money unless there is a regional lock up, because someone would have to be in the station to watch the prisoners.

A Regional Lock-up and Sheriffs Transporting arrests, coupled with a regional dispatch center, could save some money and keep what little officers that are on the streets of Worcester County back on the street faster, not stuck babysitting prisoners.

The budget crunch will be even worse this time. If things keep going the way with the police budgets, it might be back to the horrific days when towns had one police officer on overnight all by him or herself. Now thats a morale buster big time.

Posted by: Mikey682

Quote:

Originally Posted by PBC FL Cop

“With a joint police department, he said, the town would at least save the salary of a police chief

Do you really think it would end with just one position being eliminated? Well, we don't really need four leutenants, so lets cut that number in half....and eight sergeants is silly, lets cut two of those... and we have plenty of reserves, soo........

RG, seriously...Sheriffs transporting prisoners and regional lockups? I have never EVER heard of a sheriffs department sending a van to a pd to pick up prisoners unless its a special circumstance. We have a hard enough time even getting them to actually accept a prisoner.

Posted by: csauce777

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edmizer1

Regional policing will come to Massachusetts. Its just a matter of time. Other parts of the country are doing it without any problem with a significant savings.

As I have mentioned before, my friend is a PO at Montgomery County PD in Maryland. The way it is set up is weird. They are a huge department with every specialized unit you can think of. Additionally, The cities within Montgomery County have their own police departments as well. All 911 calls go to the county communications section which then dispatch them to either an MCPD officer or an officer for the town where the call came from, depending on who's available. If I understood my friend correctly, if both agencies arrive at the same call, the County officer trumps the local. Additionally, a MCPD Sergeant trumps a local Sgt. Seems like it could cause some issues, however my friend says that there is enough crime and calls to go around that noone fights over anything. They all have their hands full. MCPD is always hiring, and I get the speech about making the move twice a week, at least.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rg1283

If things keep going the way with the police budgets, it might be back to the horrific days when towns had one police officer on overnight all by him or herself. Now thats a morale buster big time.

Wait...you mean everyone doesnt work alone on midnights like me??

Posted by: OutOfManyOne

They will save money by f*cking guys over. Let's say town A has 10 guys and town B has 10 guys now they say, hey we can do both PDs with 16 guys. They will also save money by not having two police stations to maintain, fewer cruisers and less supervisors, including one chief. However, do not forget it ain't hapening because of unions. Down South they can do whatever they want because they are right to work states. It will be very difficult to merge them, unless all the unions on board agree on issues, most important, seniority.

Posted by: Delta784

There has been a regional police law on the books for many years, but selectmen and police chiefs aren't going to give up their fiefdoms without a vicious fight.

Posted by: Mitpo62

Those who like the feel of a "metro" police agency should move to places like CA or FL where these agencies flourish, and do so well. To reinvent the wheel here would be disastrous. Administrators should STOP trying to fix things that aren't broke and go back to counting paper clips and staples.

Posted by: Edmizer1

A little off-topic. I think Warren has more problems than its merger idea. Their new chief apparently has a master's degree from a college in Ireland that doesn't exist. I read a news article today at work that said one of the selectmen said that it didn't really matter that his master's was questionable because he had a BS degree which is the minimum required of the position. The new chief was quoted as saying that the Irish college sent him tests to take, accepted alot of life experience, and was "cheap".

Posted by: Delta784

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edmizer1

A little off-topic. I think Warren has more problems than its merger idea. Their new chief apparently has a master's degree from a college in Ireland that doesn't exist. I read a news article today at work that said one of the selectmen said that it didn't really matter that his master's was questionable because he had a BS degree which is the minimum required of the position. The new chief was quoted as saying that the Irish college sent him tests to take, accepted alot of life experience, and was "cheap".

Edmizer, is there a link to that news story? I have a special interest in public officials who claim fake college degrees.

Posted by: csauce777

I'm pretty sure "RPD931" worked in Warren, he may be able to shed some light on this topic??

Posted by: RPD931

Quote:

Originally Posted by csauce777

I'm pretty sure "RPD931" worked in Warren, he may be able to shed some light on this topic??

Still there man!! Not much light to shed other than mere topic discussions by selectment from both towns. Their immediate thoughts are for the purpose of building a SHARED Police Station as we are both in serious need of new facilities. By sharing one LARGE facility it would cost both of our towns less money in the construction alone. We would still operate seperately but share a large building that would suit us for MANY years. Overall we have a very good partnership with each other as we have had an established mutaul aid system for years, we get along pretty well. We back each other up OFTEN.

Of course with that thought came the discussion of merging the 2 departments together. There are some differences between our agencies/towns however. Such as we have our own dispatch and W.B. uses a regional dispatch in New Braintree... our volume is too high for Central Dispatch to take. And if the PD's merged it would clearly be too much for Central Dispatch to take. So when they talk about savings on 1 chiefs salary, West Brookfield will then pick-up half the tab of the dispatch budget which will be more than the savings. Although it would cost West Brookfield more money than they are budgeted now, I think the increased services provided would be a huge benefit. W.B. has about 3,500 residents and warren has 5,000. However Warren is 3-4 times busier than west brookfield (Arrests and call volume-wise). By combining the 2 departments we would have to cover almost 50 square miles, so I don't see staff reductions occurring based on that fact. Our staffing levels are pretty much the same at each department. Normally during overnights we each only have 1 Officer on and no more than 2 during the rest of the day. So having 4 total Officers during the day end evening hours and 2 for overnights to cover 50 square miles and serve 8,500-9,000 is pretty adequate (well not really, but cuts would bring issues). I think we'd be open to discussing the idea. But like someone said, it would be based on seniority and what if any cuts would be planned. Combined we would only have 3 Sergeants, so no issue there. In a larger department it might be ideal to keep one Chief on as a Lt. or Deputy Chief, but that might bring conflict.

But most of all I don't think it would fly because each of our town's governments wants to have some control of the PD. And by merging they would lose some of that control... possibly creating a commission. But who knows.. Again, I see the benefits being given more by the services provided than money saved. I think the operational budget for W.B. for be slightly more because of the added dispatch salary costs. The savings would be good for Warren as they would save on half the dispatch budget and half a Chief's salary. But by combining the 2 it would give us more functionality (jursidiction in both towns) and would be alot easier to provide services to both communities.

Posted by: Foxy85

The article is in the T&G in the local section by Clive McDouchebag....And that candidate is now off the table as far as making him the Chief....Now a Sergeant from Dudley is next in line for the position....

Posted by: RPD931

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foxy85

The article is in the T&G in the local section by Clive McDouchebag....And that candidate is now off the table as far as making him the Chief....Now a Sergeant from Dudley is next in line for the position....

The Sergeant from Dudley is now on Board!!! They have agreed to a contract. We look forward to having HIM as Chief.

Posted by: Foxy85

Thats great to hear.....He comes from a good department....

Posted by: JMB1977

I think each town has their own issues that combining the two would upset department members from both sides. Well it works in the south...who knows?

Posted by: Mitpo62

Quote:

Originally Posted by RPD931

The Sergeant from Dudley is now on Board!!! They have agreed to a contract. We look forward to having HIM as Chief.

Is that Mike Stephens?

Posted by: Foxy85

No, its a LONG name something like Spielwazcokwoskis or something lol......

Posted by: Hb13

Rpd
I work up at the central dispatch in New Braintree and yeah the added call volume would be alot but it wouldn't necesarily be a bad thing (if we could ever get back up to full staff and get some of the others off there a$$ and make them do their job the right way) along that note about half of us would love the added call volume.
In the way of saving cost the other thing you would have to look at if the regionalized pd did happen the dispatch end of it would have to be pushed up to at least 2 dispatchers a shift so the numbers of dispatchers your towns would have to pay would double along with more disatch capapble computers, radio systems and what systems you would use wether you would stay on the low band your on now or try to get onto the 800 boat (somewhat iffy in warren to begin with being now towers and all) and the added 911 system.
Lets also say you did change radio systems and West Brookfield went down to the lowband that would require all their cruisers be re outfitted with the low bands and portables, Or if Warren went up to the 800....well yeah there is a crap load of money being dished out i.e. one portable is in the range of $1,600 to $1,700 i think if i remember correctly.
so either way it will cost alot of money for that to happen but hey west brookfield is the town that gives basically all it's money to the highway dept for trucks that don't fit down half the roads so who knows what you can talk them into!!!

Posted by: mpd61

I'm not saying anything...
I don't know enough about the two towns.

However,
sharing a sewer system would be a better idea because everybodys smell the same in both towns and...well you get the idea

Posted by: Hb13

Bruce Bieakowski.... I don't think i spelt that write but i tried.

Posted by: OutOfManyOne

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpd61

I'm not saying anything...
I don't know enough about the two towns.

However,
sharing a sewer system would be a better idea because everybodys smell the same in both towns and...well you get the idea

I don't know Woody, in some towns, people's shit don't stink you know.

ma police, boston ma police, massachusetts police, massachusetts police, mass state police, mass police, ma, mass, massachusetts, massachusetts, massachutes, massachusetts law, massachusetts polece, police, officer, police officer, cops, police gear, law enforcement, police duty gear, state police, sheriff, law, police supply, police agency directory, police agency, police department, traffic officer, police dept, state trooper, dispatcher, massachusetts county sheriff, massachusetts sheriff, massachusetts department of corrections, ma doc, doc, dept of corrections, police information, civil service, ma civil service, massachusetts crime, police training, police academy, ma police academy, massachusetts officers, masscop, masscops, mpa, bpa, ibpoa, police association, massachusetts police news, massachusetts crime news, mass most wanted, police career information, police patrol, police administration, police books, crime scene training, police discussion, crime discussions, cops

About MassCops, the home for Massachusetts law enforcement.

The Massachusetts Law Enforcement Network opened in 1998 and is now a part of the New England Police Network The site is a pro-police discussion forum intended for sworn police officers and civilian law enforcement officials as well as those interested in pursuing a career in law enforcement here in Massachusetts.

The goal of The Massachusetts Law Enforcement Network is to provide an informal network of law enforcement officials here in Massachusetts for educational and informational purposes.

The forum covers many topics such as Police Related News Articles, Agency & Profession Discussions, Police Training as well as Law Enforcement Career Information.

The Massachusetts Law Enforcement Network and The New England Police Network (NEPN) and it's network sites are privately owned websites/domains and are not affiliated with or endorsed by any government association or agency.

MassCops (masscops.com) and (masscop.com) are privately owned are not affiliated with or endorsed by the Massachusetts Coalition of Police (masscop.org)

3 4 5 6 7 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 49 50 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108