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Florida Highway Patrol.

(Click here to view the original thread on the MassCops Message Board)

Posted by: Foxy85

I know the FHP is recruiting constantly, was wondering if anyone is planning on going down, or has already gone down recently for the testing?

Heading down to Orlando at the end of the month...Its a shot in the dark, but may be worth it in the end...


Posted by: 94c

a few years ago the pay was horrible, don't know if it has improved.


Posted by: Andy0921

I think the pay still sucks.


Posted by: screamineagle

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy0921
I think the pay still sucks.
I've heard the same thing Andy.


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

FHP starts around $34,000 with an extra $5000 for assignments in Palm Beach, Broward, Miami-Dade and Monroe Counties. Raises are given on a year-to-year basis by legislation. This year they received a zero %, with a one time $1000 bonus.

There are better agencies if anyones looking to relocate to FLA!!!


Posted by: Foxy85

Its not pretty down there when it comes to pay, but its a way into the job for an inpatient young guy.....

Its 33,000 - 38,000 dpending on where you live, with no step plan....they have been working on changing it, but it still below what most other departments make....

Cost of living varies, and OT is plentiful, you can make it easily on the pay, just have to work some OT too.....Its worth a shot...

I've heard a bunch of mixed opinions on the agency....The bad ones can really be said about any agency though....


Posted by: Andy0921

Quote:
The bad ones can really be said about any agency though....
It all comes down to what you make of it...You will hear bad things about it from the disgruntled old vets and good things from the young guns...


Posted by: SinePari

If I were going down south, I'd try one of the larger sheriffs departments. FHP's jurisdiction ends at the off-ramps. Strictly traffic enforcement.


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Sine,

That's a common misconception. We have statewide jurisdiction. In most counties separate units are assigned to the "highways". I am assigned to a county, and work all of the roads in the unicorporated parts of the county. I can't remember the last time I worked on an actual highway or an "off ramp" for that matter. On enforcement overtime, I usually either work near my house (which is in city limits) or in the downtown area. In a few counties, we only work state roads, which is where this misconception comes from. Half the major throroughfares in my county are state roads. In most counties the Sheriff's Office will work the short form crashes (minor crashes) and FHP will work the long form crashes (Injuries, Hit and Run, Criminal Charges, Fatal etc.), highway or not. True though, traffic enforcement only.

For the Rest,

The further south you go, the worse off you are for pay. Our pay is pretty comparable to pay rates in a lot of the cities and counties in the North part of the state. I could get a decent size raise if I went to the city or the county, but there are alot of unrealized benefits working for the state, if your primary concern is not money. With new management in our parent agency things are in the works to improve the pay situation. Unfortunatley, we are bound by the the legislature funds every year.

In the end, it depends on what you want to do, and what is important to you. Pay rates down here are deceiving anyway. I make less per hour here than I did in MA, but I take home more because I'm not paying state income tax.


Posted by: Foxy85

Pearl is a recruiter for the F.H.P. in his off time


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by PearlOnyx
Sine,That's a common misconception. We have statewide jurisdiction. In most counties separate units are assigned to the "highways". I am assigned to a county, and work all of the roads in the unicorporated parts of the county. I can't remember the last time I worked on an actual highway or an "off ramp" for that matter. On enforcement overtime, I usually either work near my house (which is in city limits) or in the downtown area. In a few counties, we only work state roads, which is where this misconception comes from. Half the major throroughfares in my county are state roads. In most counties the Sheriff's Office will work the short form crashes (minor crashes) and FHP will work the long form crashes (Injuries, Hit and Run, Criminal Charges, Fatal etc.), highway or not. True though, traffic enforcement only.
Your jurisdiction is limited to traffic only? So you can't make a domestic arrest in a highway rest area?

That doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.


Posted by: NegroRotary

FHP here I come!


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta784
Your jurisdiction is limited to traffic only? So you can't make a domestic arrest in a highway rest area?

That doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.
They have full arrest powers throughout the state, however their primary function is traffic enforcement on the highways and state roads. If there was an accident on a highway, city police or the county sheriffs may respond, however FHP would be contacted to complete the accident report. Now if a homicide, sex crime or serious felony occurred on the highway, FHP would contact the PD or SO to conduct the investigation. At least thats how it works in South Florida. FHP's investigations unit normally work drivers license fraud, vehicle frauds etc.

If someone was looking for a diverse career in law enforcement ie, homicide, persons crimes, vice, fugitives etc., the sheriff's offices or larger city PD's would be the better career path. If your interested in 25 years of traffic enforcement and accident reports, FHP would be for you.
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Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by PBC FL Cop
Now if a homicide, sex crime or serious felony occurred on the highway, FHP would contact the PD or SO to conduct the investigation.
Does that include less serious criminal offenses like a garden variety domestic?


Posted by: Mitpo62

What alot of folks from around here don't understand about Fla., is that there is alot of "unincorporated" areas. Another words, the city/town boundaries don't run up against each other like they do around here. When I worked as a city cop there, areas which were "unincorporated" were covered by the sheriff for law enforcement duties, etc. However, if an accident or "crash" occurred in an unincorportated area then FHP was called because the sheriff's office did not work crashes. So, in theory, you could have three different cruisers at one crash site. People not from Fla. were very often confused by this practice. And because of the practice, many times folks waited a long time for a copper to respond because there weren't many troopers assigned to our area.
This multi-jurisdictional problem has, over the years, prompted alot of calls to "consolidate" the police services. It was done in Dade County (Miami) and Duval County (Jacksonville). Another solution for cities was to incorporate, or annex, those unincorporated areas and take over all municipal services. This of course was resisted many times because folks don't want their taxes going up. Instead of just paying a county property tax, once annexed they would have to pay a city property tax.
In spite of this though, it is still a great place to cut one's teeth in this career field. You'll certainly earn your bacon (no pun intended) wearing a badge in F L A.


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta784
Does that include less serious criminal offenses like a garden variety domestic?
They are cops, so if the crime was one, which typically which could be handled by uniform patrol, then they would probably make an arrest. I'm not sure how many domestics occur on the highway, but they are still law enforcement, so they would have to make a domestic arrest if they happened upon one.

I remember a case of an abduction and sexual assault, which occurred on I-95, which spanned over three counties. The victim was dropped off in the city, however the abduction and sexual assault took place throughout two other counties and originated and took place on the highway. The victim dialed 911 and we responded. Upon learning the specifics of the crime, we contacted FHP, which was truly the agency who would have had full jurisdiction over the case. A uniform trooper showed up and was dumbfounded about what to do. The Tpr took a brief statement a released the victim telling her they would be in touch. He then stated to our detectives "There's not much I can do with this" then I guess he went back to writing his tickets.


Posted by: SouthSideCobras

If my memory is correct I remember watching late eighties early nineties episodes of COPS which had FHP working patrol on the wild streets of Miami.


Posted by: tms1989

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mitpo62
What alot of folks from around here don't understand about Fla., is that there is alot of "unincorporated" areas. Another words, the city/town boundaries don't run up against each other like they do around here. When I worked as a city cop there, areas which were "unincorporated" were covered by the sheriff for law enforcement duties, etc. However, if an accident or "crash" occurred in an unincorportated area then FHP was called because the sheriff's office did not work crashes. So, in theory, you could have three different cruisers at one crash site. People not from Fla. were very often confused by this practice. And because of the practice, many times folks waited a long time for a copper to respond because there weren't many troopers assigned to our area.
Well, why doesn't the sheriff just work accidents down there? , seems like that would solve the problem


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by tms1989
Well, why doesn't the sheriff just work accidents down there? , seems like that would solve the problem
When its on a highway or state road, its FHP responsibility to handle accidents.


Posted by: tms1989

I checked on th FHP's recruitment site, what exactly qualifys as "Two years of public contact experience",? does that basicly just mean you had a job interacting with the general public?


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by PBC FL Cop
I'm not sure how many domestics occur on the highway, but they are still law enforcement, so they would have to make a domestic arrest if they happened upon one.
I don't think I've ever been at a busy highway rest area where there hasn't been a domestic going on.

Does FHP book their own prisoners, or do you guys have central booking through the sheriff/county jail?


Posted by: Mitpo62

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta784
I don't think I've ever been at a busy highway rest area where there hasn't been a domestic going on.

Does FHP book their own prisoners, or do you guys have central booking through the sheriff/county jail?
Delta, most areas there have central booking at the county jail. That's one aspect of the job I miss, not having to deal with bookings. We only brought prisoners to the station on OUI arrests to do the video/breath tests, then off to the jail afterwards. Alot of the cruisers today have built in video, so the OUI stuff is actually done right on the street....you capture the best "performances" that way.


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

That is a nice thing about FLA, you don't have to worry about booking and bailing your arrests. You transport them to the sheriff's jail, though many SO's will come to your station and pick them up, and they take it from there. The officer/deputy/trooper/agent is back on the street where they belong, not babysitting criminals or trying to arrange bail.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tms1989
I checked on th FHP's recruitment site, what exactly qualifys as "Two years of public contact experience",? does that basicly just mean you had a job interacting with the general public?
If your job consists of speaking with one or more people during a 40 hour work week, your qualified to be an FHP trooper


Posted by: 94c

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mitpo62
What alot of folks from around here don't understand about Fla., is that there is alot of "unincorporated" areas. Another words, the city/town boundaries don't run up against each other like they do around here. When I worked as a city cop there, areas which were "unincorporated" were covered by the sheriff for law enforcement duties, etc. However, if an accident or "crash" occurred in an unincorportated area then FHP was called because the sheriff's office did not work crashes. So, in theory, you could have three different cruisers at one crash site. People not from Fla. were very often confused by this practice. And because of the practice, many times folks waited a long time for a copper to respond because there weren't many troopers assigned to our area.
This multi-jurisdictional problem has, over the years, prompted alot of calls to "consolidate" the police services. It was done in Dade County (Miami) and Duval County (Jacksonville). Another solution for cities was to incorporate, or annex, those unincorporated areas and take over all municipal services. This of course was resisted many times because folks don't want their taxes going up. Instead of just paying a county property tax, once annexed they would have to pay a city property tax.
In spite of this though, it is still a great place to cut one's teeth in this career field. You'll certainly earn your bacon (no pun intended) wearing a badge in F L A.
Sheriffs, Locals, and Highway Patrol all showing up at one scene.
I think I'll start a FloridaCops.com just for the entertainment value


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Delta,

As PBC said, we are sworn law enforcement officers, so we can enforce anything. Since law enforcement basic training is standardized in Florida, we receive the same basic training as a Deputy or Police Officer. In general, most non-traffic criminal matters are passed off to the Sheriff's Office just due to resources and time. It also depends on your supervisor and his personal theroy on turning things over to the Sheriffs. I've worked batteries, thefts, and carjackings, but this isn't very common. We have our call load, and the sheriffs have theirs. They're not going to work our car crash if they roll up on it, so usually we won't work their domestic. On the turnpike things are a little different. Usually whatever happens out there, short of a murder belongs to us. I wouldn't expect the average Deputy to work a complicated traffic fatality, just as he probably wouldn't expect me to work some sort of other complicated investigation. Either of us could do it with some guidance, but it's just not what we do all the time. It's just a question of resources and area of responsibility.

PBC,

That is not true in all counties however. In South Florida, we only work state roads. Here in Orange County and several other counties, we are responbible for all county and state roads in unicorporated areas, as well as smaller cities and towns that contract with the county for police services. There are several state roads within city limits, which we are not responsible for. In other counties like Osceola, the Sheriff's work the short-form crashes, and we work the long form crashes. It's a strange system, and it varies from county to county. I've never really understood it.

In the end, we are a traffic enforcement agency, and that is what we do well. If you want to do traffic work, then we are the agency for you. If you are not interested in traffic work, you'll probably be disapointed. I work a few traffic crashes a day, and I make a ton of traffic stops and traffic misdemenor and felony arrests. Traffic stops are a great way to come up with guns, drugs, stolen vehicles and all sorts of other stuff. We get alot of that too. That's what I enjoy doing. It may not be for everybody =)


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by PearlOnyx
PBC,

That is not true in all counties however. In South Florida, we only work state roads.
Florida is a unique state, they always say North and South Florida should be two different states!!

Stay safe!!


Posted by: Foxy85

The "requirements for qualification" to be a FHP Trooper may be broad, but I think they just do that because they are so short handed, they want any body who thinks they can do the job and do it well.....The process, being set up the way it is, filters out many of the undesirables.... I'll be curious to see whom I take my PAT/written exam with.....I'm still early in the process, and expect to see some ....well....rather less than qualified people show up to the testing....haha.....looking forward to the trip down....The only thing working against me to knock me out of the running is myself....Wish me luck...


Posted by: KozmoKramer

Best of Luck Foxy! I'm sure you will perform excellently..


Posted by: NegroRotary

Good luck Foxy...let me know how that goes!

I don't know why a lots of ppl talk bad about FHP (this includes other FL officer that I know and I met while I was going through the academy in FL) beside the salary, I don't think they are a bad agency, Mass State Police main mission is highway just like FHP..wether you do traffic or domestic, you still at risk no matter what, to me I rather do traffic and work for the state than the city, being that i'm a reservist, I think in the long run I will benefit working with the state more and maybe later on i can work for FDLE as a Special Agent too, just my 2 cents...


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by NegroRotary
maybe later on i can work for FDLE as a Special Agent too, just my 2 cents...
FDLE only hires LEO's with detective/investigative experience and FHP will not give you that. If investigations is your long term goal, you'ld be wasting your time with FHP.


Posted by: Deuce

Quote:
Originally Posted by NegroRotary
Mass State Police main mission is highway just like FHP

Uh oh...


Posted by: Foxy85

I don't think he meant that maliciously (spelling?)......Its the nature of the beast....as you travel up and down the highways....to include state roads as well....its primarily MSP enforcing the traffic laws....I don't think he meant it as being AAA with a gun or anything....if you think about it.....75% of uniformd police work is chapter 90.... if you work in a large department then there are specific "traffic divisions", but for the most part, the job consist of a lot of traffic...I don't think it was a dig towards the MSP....

I may recant this later on in life, but I am more interested in traffic enforcement right now than the service calls....eg domestics, robbery etc....

Just my opinion, its all what you make of it....


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxy85
75% of uniformd police work is chapter 90.... if you work in a large department then there are specific "traffic divisions", but for the most part, the job consist of a lot of traffic...
In low crime, rural areas, traffic is a major portion of a law enforcement officers job, however in an urban environment the enforcement of traffic laws is not a priority for the average patrol officer.


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxy85
75% of uniformd police work is chapter 90
Ummmm.......no.

I haven't seen my citation book in over 2 weeks, and I've been plenty busy lately.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxy85
I may recant this later on in life, but I am more interested in traffic enforcement right now than the service calls....eg domestics, robbery etc....
Domestics and robberies aren't service calls, they're priority calls. A service call is a past B&E, loud music, dog barking, parking enforcement, etc.

Some people like to spend their careers doing traffic, more power to them. It just isn't my bag.


Posted by: MM1799

Quote:
Originally Posted by NergoRotary
Mass state police main mission is highway
Wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxy85
Its the nature of the beast....as you travel up and down the highways....to include state roads as well....its primarily MSP enforcing the traffic laws...
Wrong... again.

The "job" is vast and varies from area to area, troop to troop. In some troops, the demographics call for troopers to concentrate their patrols on highways and state roads. In other troops, the demographics and police forces (or lack of..) force troopers to concentrate on being the main police force for the residents and supplementing local departments.

To paraphrase the MSP website; the primary mission of the MSP is provide quality policing to the citizens of the Commonwealth. Whether that is on the highways or in somebody's house.

I am not going to list and explain the various units, I'd be here all day. Go the MSP website and search vfas, gang, cat, also click on "Barracks" and read the little paragraphs explaining them. Then come back and tell me if the MSP is primarily "highway".

Don't take this post as an insult or scathing. Simply a correction to an ignorant statement.


Sorry to change the subject, back to to the FHP.
A relative of mine works for the FHP and works stictly on the highway. She enjoys it and I don't get the sense she misses working the city (she is a fomer city PO).
Like every job: it's not for everyone! Besides, it's freakin' sunny FL


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by MM1799
Wrong... again.
Well, I think Foxy85 is 100% correct in saying the state police are the ones conducting traffic enforcement on highways in the state. Since the Mets and the RMV Police are history, who else is going to do it? Once in a great while we'll cover a crash on a highway if MSP has no one available, but we certainly don't do any proactive enforcement.

Likewise on MDC/DCR roads....we'll make traffic stops for violations we see, cover a crash if MSP has no one available (which is more common on a DCR road than the highway for some reason), and of course assist a trooper if they need backup, but our rules & regs specifically state we will not run radar or conduct proactive enforcement on a state road.

After reading this thread, I like the idea of being able to drop back & punt the shit-sandwich traffic crashes to an agency that is specfically tasked with traffic.

Anyone else up for the Massachusetts Highway Patrol?


Posted by: MM1799

Fair enough, I read Foxy's post a little differently.
We do enforcement on the highways, it is not our main mission.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta784
After reading this thread, I like the idea of being able to drop back & punt the shit-sandwich traffic crashes to an agency that is specfically tasked with traffic.
I'd suggest moving to FL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta784
Anyone else up for the Massachusetts Highway Patrol?
Since they wont be patrolling their city; anytime those unstaffed sector cars from Quincy would like to team up and patrol the highway for free, works for me.


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by MM1799
Since they wont be patrolling their city; anytime those unstaffed sector cars from Quincy would like to team up and patrol the highway for free, works for me.
Let's combine our unstaffed sector cars with your unstaffed patrols when there is a "desk and two".

We can call it Ghost Patrol.


Posted by: Foxy85

Well, let me clarify, and again stress that my comments weren't a dig at the MSP. Perhaps I was misunderstood.... MSP on the highways, primarily enforces traffic laws.....not to say MSP out in western Mass, don't act as primary law enforcement for the citizens of Ma. And I know about different divisions of MSP which serve different purposes....

But the average trooper patroling towns and highways with their own police, I would say concentrate on traffic enforcement.....

As far as the unifromed police job being 75% chapter 90....My opinion is from a guy who works in Southern Worcester County. Douglas, Uxbridge, Millville, Blackstone, Northbridge and Sutton....

I've heard from a few officers from various towns, who come to court state they are looking to transfer because all they do is chapter 90 all shift....I've also heard this from a Shrewsbury police officer....Not to say they don't get service calls, or other calls, but alot of it is Chapter 90....

This is just from what I've heard from those towns....

Northbridge is a little more busy due to the area called "the village" which is like South Main street in worcester. Obviously on a MUCH SMALLER scale....

MSP's primary mission may not be traffic enforcement, but I imagion it takes up a big part of the average troopers day....at least in the areas with their own police force....


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Let's keep this on topic if we can and not turn this in to a anti-MSP back and forth. I think the comment was innocent! =)

Negro,

FDLE does look for investigative experience when hiring. We do have a Traffic Homicide Investigation program (this is what our Corporals do for the most part), that would provide you the requisite investigative experience. Although, I'm not sure FDLE is real strict on that requirement either. There was a girl that was going through the TCC academy, at the same time I was in the academy, who was sponsored by FDLE. I have no interest in working for them, so I've never really looked in to it all that hard.

It's funny, people talk about traffic enforcement like it's some kind of disease or something =) I could go to a city or county fairly easily, but I have no desire to because I enjoy traffic enforcement. Like anything else, I guess you have to like it to do it 40 hours a week.


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by PearlOnyx
It's funny, people talk about traffic enforcement like it's some kind of disease or something
Some people like vanilla, some chocolate. More power to people who enjoy traffic enforcement, but it "just ain't my thang".


Posted by: j809

Crime travels on wheels.


Posted by: LA Copper

Quote:
Originally Posted by j809
Crime travels on wheels.
Or better yet, criminals travel on wheels between crimes. Just ask the lieutenant with the Oklahoma Highway Patrol who initiated a traffic stop on Timothy McVeigh on his way out of town after the Oklahoma City bombing. The lieutenant had no idea who McVeigh was when he stopped him for a vehicle code violation. Talk about getting lucky!


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by PearlOnyx
Negro,

Like anything else, I guess you have to like it to do it 40 hours a week.
Thats all that really matters, whether or not you enjoy what your dong!!

With that said, I don't know why you had to make this a racial thing


Posted by: PearlOnyx

PBC,

What are you talking about? =)


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by PearlOnyx
Negro,
All the name calling


Posted by: Foxy85

Less than a week till show time.....

Hope they don't hate my Woostah accent too much.....


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxy85
Hope they don't hate my Woostah accent too much.....
They will, they still hate mine, even after 6 years

Best of luck!!!!


Posted by: Deuce

Quote:
Originally Posted by PBC FL Cop
They will, they still hate mine, even after 6 years

Best of luck!!!!

I don't blame em I hate it too...


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Hah,

They have accent's in Worcester? I thought that was still considered Eastern New York. I spent too much time in Tallahassee around those country folk. My accent is almost gone.


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by PearlOnyx
It's funny, people talk about traffic enforcement like it's some kind of disease or something =)
It does kinda sound like that!! Traffic enforcement is a vital police function and I did not mean to infer it was not, nor are traffic officers any less important than homicide detectives. And when it comes to traffic enforcement and/or accident investigations, FHP are some of the best in the business.


Posted by: PearlOnyx

PBC,

Aww, thanks! =)


Posted by: NegroRotary

wow, i guess i said the wrong thing about MSP, sorry lol

Anyway I rather do traffic than to go on a domestic anytime...


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by NegroRotary
Anyway I rather do traffic than to go on a domestic anytime...
At least at a domestic, there's a chance you do something positive for the victim.

About 99.99999999% of OUI arrests are a complete waste of 3 hours of your life that you're never getting back.


Posted by: NegroRotary

Like I said, I rather do traffic than Domestic!!!!


Posted by: csauce777

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta784
At least at a domestic, there's a chance you do something positive for the victim.
Yeah until its time for the victim to help themselves after you've given them the tools and they turn around and bail the shitbag out, vacate the order, or refuse to aid in prosecution...


Posted by: Mitpo62

Traffic citations, domestic arrests, OUIs....to me they all have one thing in common (sound of cash register please)....COURT TIME! AKA - $$$$


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Mitpo,

There you go! All that aside guys, like I said, everyone plays their role in the system. That's what makes it a system. Just everyone has their preferences what part they want to play in that system.


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by csauce777
Yeah until its time for the victim to help themselves after you've given them the tools and they turn around and bail the shitbag out, vacate the order, or refuse to aid in prosecution...
I said "chance".


Posted by: Foxy85

I passed the PAT, and feel I did pretty well on the written exam, but we'll see... Everyone there was very professional, and informative, the major looked like they peeled him out of a magazine, very squared away, and sharp...

Though I passed the PAT, and out of the group of 8-10 guys that tested with me, i think I had the worst time, at about 4:40, but everyone passed.

The troopers down there are a good bunch of guys. The major and the Captain were very informative as to what to expect down the road in the hiring process....

Though the PAT is by no mean OVERLY difficult, I have more respect for it after doing it.....That dummy drag killed me, and everyone....It rained the whole time I was down there, except during the PAT. I was the only schmuck who chose to wear sweats, as I i didn't want to deal with the bugs.....Come time to do the low crawl, my sweats soaked up every ounce of water and mud that was around that obstacle....While I know it only affected my time maybe 1 - 2 seconds, I had to hold my pants up for the remaineder of the course hahaha.....It was a good time, and good expereince, now I'm gonna freak out ove rthe polygraph...


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Congrats!!!!


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Foxy,

Welcome to Central Florida during the summer. That's probably the only complaint I have about the weather. During the summer, it pretty much rains for at least an hour every day. It's like living in the tropics. It's nice when I'm walking around in shorts and a T-shirt in January though =)


Posted by: NegroRotary

Foxy don't feel bad, I did the PAT in 2005, i did it in aboutthe same time as you, now i might take the whole 6 minutes.. Congrats, you are on your way to the academy, let me know how everything goes.

Pearl you guys still have the Mercury Marauder?


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Neg,

There are some Marauders out there. They are mostly for guys assigned to specialized enforcement. Basically, those guys just got out and stop cars all day. No calls for service. Pretty good job if you ask me.


Posted by: NegroRotary

I know, I would love to get my hand on those Marauder...


Posted by: Foxy85

I'm kind of curious as to what kind of vehicles the new recruits get out of the academy....New cruisers, slightly used and beat up, or left over junk until you hand yours down to the next class?


Posted by: NegroRotary

junks, left over, beat up lol, you are not expecting to get a new car as a recruit?


Posted by: Foxy85

No, but in Mass, the recruits are 3,4, or in this case going on 5 years apart from other recruits...where as Florida puts on 2 academies a year, with45-60 guys in each one....was just wondering how recycling cruisers work with such a high number of new troopers always cycled in...


Posted by: leoinfl

Foxy,

A lot of guys get caught up on the Polygraph, don't worry about it. Tell them the truth, everyone has done something wrong at some point, no one's perfect and they know that. You'll be given time with the polygraph examiner to go over everything and explain things out to him/her prior to being hooked up to the actual polygraph machine and that's the time to be honest.

Next time don't wear sweats!!! Hahaha Ironically FL has none of the bugs and mosquitos like in New England, so don't worry about that. You'll just have to dodge a few lightning strikes from time to time!!! All in all it's a great place, hot and humid for a part of the year, but it's better then going out to shovel the driveway and freeze your arse off!

Good luck!


Posted by: Foxy85

Thanks LEOINFL, I've got nothing to hide, so I'm worried TOO much about the polygraph, just that in MA, they are not allowed to use them, but in most other states, they rely on them, so it freaks me out a bit....but the most common thing people kep telling me is to be honest, and thats exactly what I plan on doing....I'd rather not get the job from telling the truth, than not get the job from lying....

Yeah the sweats thing was stupid....I packed shorts too, just made a poor judgement call haha...thats ok though..... cause I passed, and thats all that matters....Waiting on the written exam score, should be about another week, the Captain told me, about 2 weeks from the time you take it.....So I'm excited....


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Foxy,

As far as cars go, I had a 2001 for about 3 months. Then I got a 2005, and I had that for the rest of the year. I just got a 2006 about three weeks ago, and I'll be keeping that until I run out the mileage and it hits the trade list. They are slowly phasing out the pre-2006 cars with the old light bars in favor of the newer cars with the New Code 3 Led bars.


Posted by: Foxy85

So you had a junker for about 3 months....thats not that bad.....

Whats the deal with the Community Service Officer's..... what exactly is their job...?


Posted by: NegroRotary

Pearl is that true that you guys get a cost of living allowance?


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxy85
Whats the deal with the Community Service Officer's..... what exactly is their job...?
CSO's are non-sworn employees of a sheriff or police department who investigate traffic crashes/accidents. They complete accident reports and issue citations when appropriate.


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Foxy,

For the most part, you'll be stuck with an older car for about year. It depends on where you go too though. In the city, we tend to get more cars wrecked and what not, so cars are a hot commodity. My buddy works up in the woods in the panhandle and got a nice car pretty much right off the bat. CSO's work all of the minor crashes. They can not write criminal tickets, and do not work fatals. They also pick up DAV's and what not, so we can concentrate on enforcement. You'll only see them in Orlando and Tampa, and maybe Miami if I remember correctly.

Negro,

Many of the south Florida counties get an extra $5K per year. I believe Monroe County and Collier County may get more, since the Keys are super expensive to live in. The exact amounts and counties are listed on the website.


Posted by: NegroRotary

oh ok, i see, but 38K in Miami is not enough!


Posted by: OutOfManyOne

Quote:
Originally Posted by PBC FL Cop
CSO's are non-sworn employees of a sheriff or police department who investigate traffic crashes/accidents. They complete accident reports and issue citations when appropriate.
Wow, how can non-sworn people write citations and complete crash reports? Our unions here would go nuts.


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutOfManyOne
Wow, how can non-sworn people write citations and complete crash reports? Our unions here would go nuts.
Police unions down South range from "unheard of" to "extremely rare".


Posted by: csauce777

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutOfManyOne
Wow, how can non-sworn people write citations and complete crash reports? Our unions here would go nuts.
I'd be all set if I had someone to book accidents, and write citations...then I could get some sleep


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutOfManyOne
Wow, how can non-sworn people write citations and complete crash reports? Our unions here would go nuts.
I remember working patrol and going from call to call, it was great when you had the CSO's to handle your accident calls, it would free up the zone cars to be more proactive. The unions have more important issues other than who's writing traffic tickets.


Posted by: OutOfManyOne

I don't care how busy we are, we would NEVER allow a non-sworn non union member, civilian to do our police tasks. That is just stupid, instead of hiring more cops you got these people taking jobs away.


Posted by: PearlOnyx

OutOfMany,

State law allows for traffic crash investigation officers, who are allowed by statute to write traffic citations. Ours don't, but one of the local cities even allows their CSO's to write criminal cites for traffic offenses, DWLS and what not.

As far as allowing non-sworn folks to "do our work", you have to consider that this is a very different state, a very conservative state. From a management standpoint it is much more fiscally responsible to employ a CSO at $28K per year to go out and work all the petty stuff, than it is to hire a Trooper at $35K+. They are also not assigned take home vehicles and go through a much shorter academy, so they are saving the state quite a bit of money. Staffing isn't an issue anyway, we're not really losing positions, since we are never at full authorized force.

Also, as someone mentioned, the union situation is very different. Personally, I like our system better, but it's a matter of opinion.


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutOfManyOne
I don't care how busy we are, we would NEVER allow a non-sworn non union member, civilian to do our police tasks. That is just stupid, instead of hiring more cops you got these people taking jobs away.
Obviously your department is not that busy, or you wouldn't care.


Posted by: OutOfManyOne

Quote:
Originally Posted by PBC FL Cop
Obviously your department is not that busy, or you wouldn't care.
Again your southern mentality shows, you guys are losing jobs and OT because of those bozos but as a non-union company man you don't see it.


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutOfManyOne
Again your southern mentality shows, you guys are losing jobs and OT because of those bozos but as a non-union company man you don't see it.
One day, when you grow up, maybe you too will become a COP, then maybe you'll get it.


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by PBC FL Cop
One day, when you grow up, maybe you too will become a COP, then maybe you'll get it.
As much as it pains me, I have to agree with OutOfMany's sentiments, if not his delivery method. The pay, benefits, and especially paid details we enjoy in Massachusetts are a direct result of strong police unions. Every attempt to torpedo the Quinn Bill and every flagman bill has been stopped because of strong police unions. My city has an ordinance requiring detail police officers, even if the state allows flagmen, because of a strong police union.

The downside of powerful police unions is that on occasion someone will keep their job when they shouldn't, but a lot more good people keep their jobs because of it.


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta784
As much as it pains me, I have to agree with OutOfMany's sentiments, if not his delivery method. The pay, benefits, and especially paid details we enjoy in Massachusetts are a direct result of strong police unions. Every attempt to torpedo the Quinn Bill and every flagman bill has been stopped because of strong police unions. My city has an ordinance requiring detail police officers, even if the state allows flagmen, because of a strong police union.

The downside of powerful police unions is that on occasion someone will keep their job when they shouldn't, but a lot more good people keep their jobs because of it.
No argument here, I've been a union member for 20yrs, both in MA and FL. In that time I've had the opportunity to work with some great cops, but when it comes to LEO's who just talk out of the ass, on subjects which they are ignorant, they, unfortunately, are just One out of Many.


Posted by: OutOfManyOne

So you don't mind having a non-sworn civilian doing your job for less money instead of hiring more officers. Great logic there, "we're too busy so we hire civilans to do our job". Last I checked Boston,Worcester,Springfield,Brockton haven't relinquished their cite books to civilians and I am sure all those places are busier than yours. It's just a matter of time when one of these fools gets killed, kinda like the RMV in MA when they were stopping cars with no guns,but at least they were sworn. Seems to me like you are the ignorant one and your logic is coming right out of your ass as we can all see.


Posted by: PearlOnyx

OutofMany,

Since this is a topic about my agency, I'd like to keep it on topic about my agency, and keep the argument to a minimum. Referring specifically to FHP, our actual number of sworn officers is less than our authorized force, and pretty much has been for years due to a lack of qualified applicants and turn over. Our agency personally, is not losing any positions. We haven't even filled all the ones that we have. As far as safety, I do share your concerns, but this is the system that we have, and it's not changing.

As I mentioned previously, this is a very different state than MA with very different values and ideals. While other states such as MA are reducing positions, we are being given more. We are experiencing huge growth, and this is one way that the legislature has seen fit to address that. I make good money, good benefits, and all of the off-duty (details) that I want, same way I did when I was up there.

There are a few people on the board that are applying here and this thread was started to sort of discuss those issues and what not. I appreciate the debate, but let's keep the name calling and what not to a minimum so it doesn't get closed and those people can discuss if they want. If you guys want to start another thread and discuss my system is better than yours, feel free.


Posted by: LA Copper

I'm just wondering why it's so wrong to share the wealth with "non-sworn" folks? Are we that selfish that we can't allow other human beings to benefit from this type of work?

While it might not be the safest job for non-sworn personnel, your argument that they are taking work away from sworn officers is a bit selfish. After all, didn't we all take an oath to "help people" and not "make as much money as possible." Maybe it's just me.......


Posted by: JLT770

this is on topic, but nothing to do with non sworn officers

What's the deal with the sunglasses rules, NO MIRRORED SUNGLASSES... that is the only reason i would want to be on FHP, and I could not even wear them...boo


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by LA Copper
After all, didn't we all take an oath to "help people" and not "make as much money as possible." Maybe it's just me.......
It's not just you, it's why a COP takes the job. A cops job is to protect and serve the public, not protect their citation books at all costs.


Posted by: Deuce

PBC don't forget who you're dealing with up here. Of all the states I've lived,been stationed,visited, etc people from MA are the most selfish.I guess that includes some of us wearing a badge. Guess that's why my union is impotent since 95% of the guys are just in it for the money....


Posted by: csauce777

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutOfManyOne
So you don't mind having a non-sworn civilian doing your job for less money instead of hiring more officers. Great logic there, "we're too busy so we hire civilans to do our job". Last I checked Boston,Worcester,Springfield,Brockton haven't relinquished their cite books to civilians and I am sure all those places are busier than yours. It's just a matter of time when one of these fools gets killed, kinda like the RMV in MA when they were stopping cars with no guns,but at least they were sworn. Seems to me like you are the ignorant one and your logic is coming right out of your ass as we can all see.
I'm not taking sides here, but I dont think that the highlighted info above is necessarily correct. Florida is busy, Boston aside, Worcester, Springfield, and Brockton are simply small cities as far as US cities go. They are not the crime meccas people here want to think they are. Even Boston with 596,000 people and 75 homicides in 2006, is not even close to some other cities of comparable size. For example, Baltimore at 608,000 people had 276 murders last year. Detroit at 850,327 had 417, Minneapolis with only 376,277 people had 57 killings, St. Louis with 346,000 people had 129 murders. New Orleans had 431,000 people and 162 murders.

As for smaller cities...Springfield Mass. had 152,644 and 15 murders and Worcester 176,956 and 6 killings. Compare that to some cities with close populations and look at their numbers...Flint, Michigan 118,256, 55 murders; Inglewood, CA 115,498, 37 murders; Richmond, CA 103,106, 42 murders; Dayton, OH 159,067, 37 murders; Ft. Lauderdale, FL 170,203, 21 murders, Miami Gardens, FL 101,115, 18 murders.

I have no doubt that other violent crime stats are comparable. As you can see from this small sample...No city in Massachusetts is a virtual killing ground.

(yes, I happen to have some free time on my hands today )


Posted by: OutOfManyOne

Quote:
Miami Gardens, FL 101,115, 18 murders.
Isnt that South Florida's paradise with a huge recruitment effort for their new PD?


Posted by: leoinfl

Pearl and LA Copper make great points and from a stand point of MA I understand Out of Many not liking that non-sworn out there writing tickets down south. But keep in mind that law enforcement down in FL is much different then up in New England. For the most part, the crime rates are drastically lower in NE when compared to FL and the communities in NE are comprised of smaller towns, which brings fewer calls of service. That being said there are a lot of great PD's and officers who are doing the job because they love it, not for the money or to get mad because of a non-sworn member who is working crashes. On average most officers don't enjoy working traffic crashes, so if there is someone who wants to do crashes all day and write the citations that go along with them, all the power to them.

For the most part in most PD's in FL you are experiencing a much higher call load as compared to certain other parts of the country and to be honest scratching out a ticket, well if there is a non-sworn who is trained to do that at a traffic crash then he/she can have it. I'll put my lights and siren on and drive around them on the way to the hot call of a man with a weapon or the 5th domestic battery call of the day.

Stay safe!


Posted by: Foxy85

Errr, this got way off base....lol.....Thanks for all the info concerning CSO's....I was just curoius, as I saw something minchined about them on the FHP website.

Anyway I got my test score back......I received a 95 on the written test. Next step is the polygraph.... So scary.....Nothing to hide, but still nerve racking....

To minchin the CSO's....

I like the idea of them handling minor crash calls to take reports.....It relieves the troopers of time consuming calls, to stay proactive in enforcing MV laws....


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deuce
PBC don't forget who you're dealing with up here.
I forgot, my bad

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxy85
Anyway I got my test score back......I received a 95 on the written test. Next step is the polygraph.... So scary.....Nothing to hide, but still nerve racking....
Congrats, the poly will be fine.

Best of luck!!


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Foxy,

Congratulations on your test score. You did very well. It's like taking the SAT's isn't it? Everything on this board gets off base if the thread goes long enough =)


Posted by: leoinfl

Congrats Foxy and you'll do fine on the poly. Good luck.


Posted by: csauce777

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutOfManyOne
Isnt that South Florida's paradise with a huge recruitment effort for their new PD?
I believe so...


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutOfManyOne
Isnt that South Florida's paradise with a huge recruitment effort for their new PD?
Miami Gardens is forming a new PD and they are recruiting heavily with a lot of incentives to develop the 180+ officer department, however the city is FAR from paradise. It is the 3rd largest city in Miami-Dade County with a high crime rate and a diverse population of just over 100,000; 79% black, 17% hispanic and 4% white. It reportedly has the largest black community in the state of Florida.

The city came in 44 out of 50 for Florida's worst city. It's border city, Opalocka, was 50th, the worst city in the state.

Anyone looking for action, they're still hiring!!!


Posted by: Foxy85

Lol, I'll stick to the trooper position....They are paying well for a reason....unfortunatly, money doesn't buy happiness....


Posted by: NegroRotary

I'm with you Foxy, you got that right!


Posted by: futureMSP

Money doesn't buy happiness, but according to this article the FHP doesn't bring happiness.

after 10 years with the FHP a Trooper leaves, his salary at exit = $32,000...WTF??

Low pay drives Florida Highway Patrol troopers to the exits
35% leave each year, creating a shortage of officers.
From the Orlando Sentinel, August 28, 2007

Longtime Florida Highway Patrol troopers continue to leave the agency in droves for higher-paying jobs as police officers, deputy sheriffs and even federal air marshals.

Many of these state troopers say they loved their jobs patrolling the state's highways and roads. But an outdated salary structure has frustrated veteran troopers, who often earn only a few thousand dollars a year more than raw new recruits.

FHP officials say the exodus of rank-and-file veterans has resulted in a current shortage of more than 200 troopers statewide. In Central Florida , there is a shortage of more than two dozen troopers. Officials estimate about 35 percent of troopers leave each year for higher-paying jobs.

Responding to the shortfall, the FHP recently launched recruitment drives targeting universities, community colleges and military veterans. In another effort to stem the tide, the agency now requires new troopers to sign a contract saying they will stay with the FHP for at least two years or pay back some of the money it cost to train them.

"In today's world, it is challenging. And it's a problem we're facing," FHP spokesman Maj. Ernesto Duarte said. "There's no magic bullet."

The trooper shortage carries consequences: It means car-accident victims often end up waiting hours for a patrol officer to arrive and take a report.

"On some days, it's crazy. You go from crash to crash to crash -- especially on rainy summer afternoons when we have a lot of wrecks," Trooper Kim Miller said. "It does get frustrating for people waiting, especially when they've had to wait for three or four hours. Some people get very upset, which I can understand."

Starting pay for a state trooper today is about $34,000 a year, according to Duarte . Because troopers are state employees, it's the Legislature that budgets money for hiring and raising salaries.

"Year after year, it was empty promises" from the Legislature, said one former trooper, who did not want to be identified because he now works as a federal air marshal. Traveling on flights around the country, he earns about $20,000 more than he was making as a trooper.

"And I'm having a great time," he said.

Across Florida , the patrol had 1,638 sworn officers at the end of July, but is making do with an 11-percent shortfall in troopers. In this area -- including Orange , Seminole, Lake , Brevard, Osceola and Volusia - there were 219 sworn officers patrolling the roads. The agency is authorized to have 26 more. Statewide, FHP officials say they are authorized to have an additional 208.

It's similar to 2000-01, a recent high watermark for departures, when the agency had more than 160 trooper vacancies with many veterans opting for early retirement.

FHP officials say they need more troopers to cope with a growing population. At the end of 2006, there were 15.7 million licensed drivers in Florida , and about 60 million tourists visit every year. Last year, troopers wrote more than 1 million citations, responded to more than 254,500 crashes and arrested almost 11,500 drivers on suspicion of DUI.

"Those are numbers that do concern us," Duarte said.

So does trooper pay.

"We're working closely with the Legislature on this," Duarte said about supplementing trooper salaries. "But we recognize that the state is going through some challenging times. In today's world, there are issues like reducing property taxes, [homeowners] insurance, gasoline prices. It affects everyone, including members of the FHP."

FHP officials plan to urge state lawmakers to adopt a salary plan in which veteran troopers are awarded $500 per year for up to 10 years or $5,000.

It costs $75,000 to $80,000 to train and equip each new recruit. But new troopers often would flee to other law-enforcement agencies soon after they were trained. To prevent that from happening, the agency instituted the two-year contract.

Trooper disenchantment with pay is a chronic problem.

The Orlando Police Department, for example, pays its starting officers about $42,300 a year, according to Officer Jim Young, a department spokesman. Young said many new recruits served two to five years with the FHP before becoming Orlando officers.

"I would say pay is probably the biggest reason," Young said. He added many troopers also want to work in different areas of law enforcement, such as bike patrol and murder investigations.

Jim Whitman left the FHP in 2004 after almost 10 years. His salary at the time was about $32,000. But when he joined the Winter Park Police Department, his pay jumped by more than $5,000.

"I was training officers that were making the same as I was, and that was frustrating," Whitman said.


Posted by: Foxy85

I think that retention pay of 500 dollars a year for up to 10 years fell through...but I'm not positive...


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxy85
I think that retention pay of 500 dollars a year for up to 10 years fell through...but I'm not positive...
Your correct, as did a 5% raise. The legislature had promised state law enforcement a 5% raise and the $500 longevity pay. They came through with a 0% raise, NO longevity pay, however they did give us a "one time" $1000 bonus, about $650 after taxes.

And they wonder why FHP troopers are leaving in droves


Posted by: NegroRotary

Damn I didn't know it was that bad for the FHP


Posted by: Foxy85

It can't stay like that forever....but I'm sure thats been said before...


Posted by: NegroRotary

FHP is a great agency, but you can make more $$$ in other agency and FL cost of living is going up


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxy85
It can't stay like that forever....but I'm sure thats been said before...
Unfortunately it's always been that way. FHP has a long history of low pay and high turnover. It's a shame!


Posted by: NegroRotary

This only happpen in FL? where the State Police make less than the rest?


Posted by: Foxy85

Georgia......32,500 to start


Posted by: Delta784

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but if Florida added 1% or 2% to their state hotel tax (which people would gladly pay to get to Disney and other FL vacation hot spots), wouldn't the state have more than enough money to pay their state troopers a decent wage?

I don't care what the cost of living in Florida is.....less than $35K for a senior trooper in the FHP is ridiculous.

Law enforcement in the South needs to seriously look into joining a heavy-duty labor union like the Teamsters or AFL-CIO in order to establish themselves. They can always go independent later.


Posted by: Mitpo62

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta784
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but if Florida added 1% or 2% to their state hotel tax (which people would gladly pay to get to Disney and other FL vacation hot spots), wouldn't the state have more than enough money to pay their state troopers a decent wage?

I don't care what the cost of living in Florida is.....less than $35K for a senior trooper in the FHP is ridiculous.

Law enforcement in the South needs to seriously look into joining a heavy-duty labor union like the Teamsters or AFL-CIO in order to establish themselves. They can always go independent later.
Florida is a "right to work" state, and as such has no binding arbitration. When I worked down there we used to refer to collective bargaining as "collective begging" because that's what it basically boils down to. You don't have to be a dues paying member of the union to enjoy the benefits of the contract. Very frustrating.


Posted by: Inspector

Florida is fast losing luster as an attractive state to settle in. While they have long touted tax laws as wonderful people are shell shocked when they buy new houses there and find that the tax bill is re-calculated and they are handed a whopping bill. Add to this the price of homeowners insurance (up to three times that on a home up here) and the lower salaries and we find little sunshine in the sunshine state. More and more people are fleeing Florida for the Carolinas, Georgia and other areas. They are called "halfbacks" because they moved there, disliked it and have come halfway back. While many still live there and love it I'd advise a full investigation before moving anywhere at this point. Oh...before considering any other southern state consider the fact many have income tax which applies to that pension some of us now collect (from Mass etc.) which here is not taxed by the state but which the Carolinas, Georgia etc. now will take a bite out of once you take up residence.


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by NegroRotary
This only happpen in FL? where the State Police make less than the rest?
Florida has state law enforcement agencies, but we don't have a "State Police." Most of the state investigative agencies have a starting salary of 50K, it's the uniformed agencies - FHP, Fish&Wildlife, DOT etc, which don't pay very well.

Most South Florida agencies have decent salaries w/plenty of details and OT. When I worked in the city, most officers I worked with were making 70+.


Posted by: BrickCop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta784
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but if Florida added 1% or 2% to their state hotel tax (which people would gladly pay to get to Disney and other FL vacation hot spots), wouldn't the state have more than enough money to pay their state troopers a decent wage?
Simple yet brilliant solution. One would that hope FL is not like MA otherwise the hacks would funnel that extra money toward pork, the troopers would never see it.


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mitpo62
Florida is a "right to work" state, and as such has no binding arbitration. When I worked down there we used to refer to collective bargaining as "collective begging" because that's what it basically boils down to. You don't have to be a dues paying member of the union to enjoy the benefits of the contract. Very frustrating.
Our officers have the option of not joining the union, they just have to pay a "service fee" which is actually more than dues, because they benefit from the contract without being actual members. Of course, there are no officers (and never have been) that have taken the service fee route.


Posted by: PearlOnyx

I've only been on for almost 2 years now, so I can only speak about what has taken place in those two years. I these two years, I've heard that the legislature was going to fund a step pay plan, only to find that that pay plan has been defeated in the legislature. Rumor has it, that this happens every year, only to leave us in the same situation that we are now, but I can't speak to that since I haven't been here all that long. I know pay is a huge issue that causes a lot of people to leave. I could make a $7K or so raise to go to a local city, but I won't because of the freedom that I enjoy as a Trooper. It's unfortunate that I have to make that choice, but it doesn't appear to be changing any time in the near future. Personally, I won't move back, or even "halfback", but I can see why people do. It depends on what you value. I still take home more every month here than I did as a county CO in Mass, because of the tax difference.


Posted by: Foxy85

THe time spent in training new troopers, only to have them leave is costing them dearly...
They've tried to drive the number of fleeing troopers down by implementing a 2 year contract...
I find this is a temporary fix.
It will have to change in the future...
I'm a young guy, so making a little less doesn't matter to me, I can work OT. But I feel bad for the veteran troopers, making the same or little more than the rookie...
I met a few troopers while i was down there taking the exam, and they are a gerat bunch of people. They work hard, and it shows. I wish the state would realize how valuable the troopers really are and pay them for what their worth...

Stay safe F.H.P.

Hoping to join the ranks....


Posted by: NegroRotary

I guess it all boil down of what you make of it, just like any place you live.


Posted by: Inspector

Just remember that when you're a police officer the luster is immediately removed from the surroundings...no matter how glamorous they are.


Posted by: PearlOnyx

It is easy to make up the difference in pay fortunatley. We have more off duty (details), hireback, and enforcement overtime than you could have the time to work.


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by PearlOnyx
It is easy to make up the difference in pay fortunatley. We have more off duty (details), hireback, and enforcement overtime than you could have the time to work.
That sounds great for a single guy....I used to hit it almost every day. With a wife and kids, I'd much rather spend time with them than wave my arms at a road construction site.


Posted by: leoinfl

Pearl what part of the state are you working out of? I worked the Pinellas County area. It's still a lot cheaper to live and work and have quality of life in most parts of FL then it is pretty much anywhere in MA or New England as a whole, go and do a cost of living calculator that you can find online. It depends what you like and what you don't want in your environment etc. Looks like policing is a lot different and I would say FL is much more progressive. I went to the academy in FL with a few other guys from Boston and I was the only one to make the move back up north and I met others who won't even give it a thought. Again, it comes down to your overall preference in lifestyle etc. In reference to the unions, definitely they're tighter and much stronger in the northeast and it would be nice to see that in FL.


Posted by: NegroRotary

There are other agencies beside FHP, if money is what matter, there plenty of cities in FL over 40K/year.


Posted by: OutOfManyOne

Quote:
I used to hit it almost every day
ME too Delta,but then I got married and two kids and it was all over.


Posted by: futureMSP

FHP probably has the problem of young guys going to work saying, I don't care if I make less, I'll just work overtime. Then when they begin to establish themselves and get the wife and kids it changes. Overtime is great, I work as much as I can while spending time with my family, but I also now that I get steps every year in addition to a Cost-of-living. If I knew that in ten years, the newest rookie would be making the same base as me that would be horrible, a moral killer. Working a lot of overtime takes a toll on you, after years of it, it can get old.

They need to fix their pay problems or they'll never be able to retain a large percentage of hires.


Posted by: NegroRotary

Lets pray they do!


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Delta,

I understand where you are coming from. I'm married. Right now, I do at least one detail per week plus at least 8 hours of enforcement overtime a week, and court OT every two weeks ago. But, I'm starting grad school in the spring, so I see where time is going to start becoming a problem. My long term plan is to study my heart out and promote as often as possible. Being a 2000 member agency, there are always promotional opportunities.

Leo,

I work out of Orlando right now. My wife is a also a civilian employee with us too, so for us to move means securing a transfer for both of us at the same time, so it makes things a little more complicated. We are thinking about going back to Tallahassee eventually. We lived there for a while, and I liked it, and rents/mortgages were about half of what they are here, and the pay is the same. It just takes some time and seniority to get up there. Cost of living aside, I really have no desire to move back to MA because of the climate, and the civil service system.


Posted by: Delta784

Quote:
Originally Posted by PearlOnyx
Delta,

I understand where you are coming from. I'm married. Right now, I do at least one detail per week plus at least 8 hours of enforcement overtime a week, and court OT every two weeks ago. But, I'm starting grad school in the spring, so I see where time is going to start becoming a problem. My long term plan is to study my heart out and promote as often as possible. Being a 2000 member agency, there are always promotional opportunities.
Pearl, I didn't mean that as any criticism towards you, I was actually criticizing the ridiculous pay schedule of your agency. As someone who went through and finished graduate school with first a VERY pregnant wife and then newborn twin babies (who are now almost 6 years old), I feel your pain.


Posted by: NegroRotary

Pearl what is the minimum time to get promote to SGT and LT?


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Delta,

Oh, I didn't take offense. I understand where you're coming from. I'm starting grad school myself now too. There are definatley problems with the agency, funding, and pay. There are a lot of positives however, that never make the news. I like to emphasize those points, since there are a few guys on here that are going through the process.

Neg,

2 Years for Corporal, 5 Years for Sergeant, 7 for Lieutenant, and 2 years in rank for each position above that. You'll take a test for each promotion. Sergeant and above also includes an assessment center after the test to rank the candidates on the list.


Posted by: NegroRotary

oh that's not bad, something to consider as well, I now Sgt Pay is in the 50's with FHP


Posted by: PearlOnyx

Neg,

If you find that you are interested in crash investigation and what not if you get on, the Corporal's positions is a 10% raise as well. It's not a supervisory position, but it's an assignment to the traffic homicide program. A lot of people promote to Sergeant without ever working THI, but if you have an interest in it it's a good 10% raise.


Posted by: NegroRotary

Pearl I believe in learning as much as I can, and if that part of it, of course i'll do it...what people fail to realized, the FHP pay is the lowest starting, but the base salary for Sgt are among the top 5 in the state and for LT as well, I saw this in the FDLE website. I like FHP cause you can move across the state.


Posted by: Foxy85

Ye old polygraph next Thursday....


Posted by: csauce777

Pearl...

I was on the FHP website and I noticed that you guys have "Auxiliary Troopers." You ever deal with those guys? Whats their story?


Posted by: Foxy85

From what I understand, they go through what is similar to a reserve academy up here....and as far as their story, I think its the same as any other auxillary unit around....They help out, they have an interest in Law Enforcement...I notice though it tends to either be older guys (possibly retired) just doing it for something to do and to help out.....or its really young guys who are trying to get their foot in the door, and test out the waters a bit....

Pearl will give more detailed info though...


Posted by: DrShredz

I met a kid this year at the NHSP test who was a FHP trooper. He said he was making around 80k this year after all was said and done. I'm not sure if he was exaggerating or not.


Posted by: PearlOnyx

CSauce,

The auxilliaries are mostly retired cops and troopers, and the occasional person trying to get in to law enforcement. If you are LE certified and don't work for 4 years, your certification expires, so an auxilliary spot is a good way to keep your certification active. We mostly use them for traffic control at large events, checkpoints, and public service stuff. Some of them also come out on their own time and pick up some of the minor calls for us. All volunteer unpaid.

Foxy,

Check your PM's. They are full. I can't respond to your question, however I wouldn't be concerned with that. As you've seen, it's not all that enforced =)

Shredz,

In South Florida with all the details and CAD pay, 70 - 80K isn't unheard of. North Florida, probably not going to happen!


Posted by: NegroRotary

I just came back from FL, man how much it did change in 2 years...there will be cop jobs for a long time, FL is growing too fast


Posted by: dpd9106

Fla. troopers leaving in droves


By Martin E. Comas
The Orlando Sentinel
FLORIDA — Longtime Florida Highway Patrol troopers continue to leave the agency in droves for higher-paying jobs as police officers, deputy sheriffs and even federal air marshals.
Many of these state troopers say they loved their jobs patrolling the state's highways and roads. But an outdated salary structure has frustrated veteran troopers, who often earn only a few thousand dollars a year more than raw new recruits.
FHP officials say the exodus of rank-and-file veterans has resulted in a current shortage of more than 200 troopers statewide. In Central Florida, there is a shortage of more than two dozen troopers. Officials estimate about 35 percent of troopers leave each year for higher-paying jobs.
Responding to the shortfall, the FHP recently launched recruitment drives targeting universities, community colleges and military veterans. In another effort to stem the tide, the agency now requires new troopers to sign a contract saying they will stay with the FHP for at least two years or pay back some of the money it cost to train them.
"In today's world, it is challenging. And it's a problem we're facing," FHP spokesman Maj. Ernesto Duarte said. "There's no magic bullet."
The trooper shortage carries consequences: It means car-accident victims often end up waiting hours for a patrol officer to arrive and take a report.
"On some days, it's crazy. You go from crash to crash to crash -- especially on rainy summer afternoons when we have a lot of wrecks," Trooper Kim Miller said. "It does get frustrating for people waiting, especially when they've had to wait for three or four hours. ... Some people get very upset, which I can understand."
Starting pay for a state trooper today is about $34,000 a year, according to Duarte. Because troopers are state employees, it's the Legislature that budgets money for hiring and raising salaries.
"Year after year, it was empty promises" from the Legislature, said one former trooper, who did not want to be identified because he now works as a federal air marshal. Traveling on flights around the country, he earns about $20,000 more than he was making as a trooper.
"And I'm having a great time," he said.
Across Florida, the patrol had 1,638 sworn officers at the end of July, but is making do with an 11-percent shortfall in troopers. In this area -- including Orange, Seminole, Lake, Brevard, Osceola and Volusia -- there were 219 sworn officers patrolling the roads. The agency is authorized to have 26 more. Statewide, FHP officials say they are authorized to have an additional 208.
It's similar to 2000-01, a recent high watermark for departures, when the agency had more than 160 trooper vacancies with many veterans opting for early retirement.
FHP officials say they need more troopers to cope with a growing population. At the end of 2006, there were 15.7 million licensed drivers in Florida, and about 60 million tourists visit every year. Last year, troopers wrote more than 1 million citations, responded to more than 254,500 crashes and arrested almost 11,500 drivers on suspicion of DUI.
"Those are numbers that do concern us," Duarte said.
So does trooper pay.
"We're working closely with the Legislature on this," Duarte said about supplementing trooper salaries. "But we recognize that the state is going through some challenging times. . . . In today's world, there are issues like reducing property taxes, [homeowners] insurance, gasoline prices. It affects everyone, including members of the FHP."
FHP officials plan to urge state lawmakers to adopt a salary plan in which veteran troopers are awarded $500 per year for up to 10 years or $5,000.
It costs $75,000 to $80,000 to train and equip each new recruit. But new troopers often would flee to other law-enforcement agencies soon after they were trained. To prevent that from happening, the agency instituted the two-year contract.
Trooper disenchantment with pay is a chronic problem.
The Orlando Police Department, for example, pays its starting officers about $42,300 a year, according to Officer Jim Young, a department spokesman. Young said many new recruits served two to five years with the FHP before becoming Orlando officers.
"I would say pay is probably the biggest reason," Young said. He added many troopers also want to work in different areas of law enforcement, such as bike patrol and murder investigations.
Jim Whitman left the FHP in 2004 after almost 10 years. His salary at the time was about $32,000. But when he joined the Winter Park Police Department, his pay jumped by more than $5,000.
"I was training officers that were making the same as I was, and that was frustrating," Whitman said.
Copyright 2007 Sentinel Communications Co.


Posted by: Foxy85

Yeah that 500 for up to 10 years , making 5,000 for longevity pay was shot down in the legislature....

Every recruiter or higher up I have spoken to has siad that the Patrol has always operated short handed and won't change requirements or standards to get their numbers up.....

Something's gotta give though...They work too hard to make that kind of money....


Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxy85
They work too hard to make that kind of money....
I wouldn't go that far


Posted by: csauce777

Quote:
Jim Whitman left the FHP in 2004 after almost 10 years. His salary at the time was about $32,000.
That is sad...




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