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Main Page Cop gear too arresting for court
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Posted by: Cinderella

Cop gear too arresting for court

A judge was blasted after ordering a cop out of his court for wearing full uniform.
Judge John Rogers said: "Why are you wearing all that equipment?"
The policeman - in body armour with baton, handcuffs and pepper spray - replied: "It's my work dress, your honour."
The Sun reports he apologised but the judge at Mold Crown Court, North Wales, said: "You don't come to court dressed like that."
It was the second time Judge Rogers has blasted a cop for turning up in full uniform.
Richard Eccles, of North Wales Police Federation, said: "Officers are often asked for help at court. They must be equipped for their own and the public's protection."
North Wales Chief Constable Richard Brunstrom has told the Courts Service he will still send officers to court in operational uniform.
A police source said: "This judge is out of touch."

http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_2342925.html?menu=

Posted by: Delta784

That is SOP for Norfolk Superior Court......on-duty people have to bring a change of clothes with them. Total foolishness.

Posted by: dh18

And how about a good number of the District courts not allowing Env. Officers to carry their weapon into the building while in uniform....

Posted by: quality617

Quote:

Originally Posted by dh18

And how about a good number of the District courts not allowing Env. Officers to carry their weapon into the building while in uniform....

We go through the same thing in some of the district courts. Apparently there is a notice from the Chief Court Officer that only officers from municipal agencies and MSP are allowed to enter any courthouse armed.

I've never had a problem anywhere around Boston, but I believe one of our officers had to disarm in Framingham.

Posted by: Duff112

Hey if anyone orders me to secure my firearm before entering anywhere guess what.... I'm not going in there. If it's court I'm not going in, but your damn straight I'm putting in for 4 hours.

At a previous PD I worked for I got a call for a disturbance at a substance abuse facility in town. I responded and when I entered the facility I was met by a female nurse who said there was a fight going on down the hall. As I headed in that direction she said "You can't bring a gun in here!!"

So, you guessed it... I turned around and walked out.

She said "Where are you going!!!" In a scared manner.

I told her "Don't call us ever again if your expecting anyone of my fellow officers to leave their firearms in the vehicles...good luck with the fight"
I left.

Within 2 days of this incident we had a letter from the director of the facility, on facility stationary, telling us that we had "Approval" to have our firearms in their facility

Posted by: dave7336

right after I read this forum, I scrolled down and read the one about a juror being punched by a defendant. I am sure that if I really wanted to dig further, I would have pulled up the numerous stories about relatives going after defendants, defendants going after attorneys, etc....

That judge better realize that the only thing that may be stopping him from getting hurt or killed is the armed cop in the courtroom!! I always have my gun with me. You never know if the person you are testifying against and sending away may want to take a shot at getting even.

Posted by: rg1283

If a police officer who is in an obvious uniform from an obviously real police agency, with all the stuff, in a COURT house then one can assume he or she is a police officer. Now if they come in all SWAT team dressed up for no real reason then I can understand.

Don't worry the "Handcuff guys" as I like to call them will assist in any armed and or fight situations in the courtroom. Leg Irons can be used as a chain to wack a whacker who is attacking. MA is the only state that does not have an armed presence in the court rooms. Please note this is not the court officer's fault.

Posted by: extremesgs

http://www.policeone.com/courthouse-...icles/1246901/

http://www.policeone.com/courthouse-...icles/1243332/

http://www.policeone.com/writers/col...rticles/97953/

Any questions now?

That's rediculous. I hear that one (yea, just one) of the judges at Newton District court won't allow college cops to carry in there, regardless of whether or not they're in uniform as well. SSPO/MPTC doesn't matter- college = no gun. I'm sure they're picky about others, too, similar to those previously post. Crazy.

Maybe start handing these articles to the judges.

Posted by: laxball33

Guys, the unfortunate thing about 95% of these judges is that they don't care about what you say, do, or hand them. Most of their silver spooned mouths feel that everyone is "really good" and didn't really carry that gun or sell those drugs. They still will be the ignorant, pretentious assess we know them to be. Just keep doing your job the best you can and to those that are having a tough time with the firearms... If you don't show up for cases just remember you can be held in contempt and judges have done it to guys in my dept. just because they were lazy and didn't want to go to court. I sucks having to pay a fine after the dink you charged got off because you didn't show. Just keep, keeping on and hopefully these guys will realize the more uniforms in the court the better and this doesn't include those funky black robes.

Posted by: Bigboy108

No problems with that out here in LA. Only place we cant carry in uniform or plain clothes is Federal Court and also when we get sued in civil court. Which happens quite a bit on the left coast.

Posted by: dh18

I think the big problem in Mass right now is that one of the security managers for the courts decided that anyone who gets their power thru SSPO is not eligible to carry a firearm into the court house. Now this manager has no idea who has SSPO and who doesn't so they declared that only municipal police and the MSP qualify under this policy. So the MEP was lumped into the SSPO pile even though their powers are under their own statute, as are the state university and college PDs.

Posted by: BPD3352

Didn't a lawyer get stabbed in a court house by a cuffed man not too long ago?? Now if someone was to go after say a police officer with a sharpened tool what am I suppost to say, not right now I had to lock everything up in the gun locker, come back at lunch or after 3...

Posted by: secret squirrel

If more judges got victimized by criminals....I think you would see their minds change overnight!!!!! What a jackass!!

Posted by: New Hire

Quote:

Originally Posted by rg1283

Don't worry the "Handcuff guys" as I like to call them will assist in any armed and or fight situations in the courtroom. Leg Irons can be used as a chain to wack a whacker who is attacking. MA is the only state that does not have an armed presence in the court rooms. Please note this is not the court officer's fault.

You're dead on right..and I'm VERY curious to see what it's going to take to change it...

Posted by: honor12900

Quote:

Originally Posted by New Hire

You're dead on right..and I'm VERY curious to see what it's going to take to change it...

Unfortunately change like that comes with a heavy cost.

Posted by: pahapoika

our transportation guys have to wear civies because they tranport to federal courts.

clean shaven , kaki pants , army boots , black windbreakers with bulging holsters are a dead give away , but i guess it keep the judges happy.

if the court officers don't carry and they take the guns away from the cops , who protects the court ?

Posted by: New Hire

Quote:

Originally Posted by pahapoika

if the court officers don't carry and they take the guns away from the cops , who protects the court ?

the court officers....

Posted by: rg1283

How about Tasers for a start (Better then Nothing)? I always thought Court Officers carried OC. Until I was stuck on a Jury years a go, I realized how little (nothing) they carry.

Posted by: Tuna

I'm with MEP and this morning I was in Worcester DC and was asked to secure my firearm. They wanted me to place it Loaded (no clearing barrel) in a piece of wooden office (printer stand) ,furnature. No lock, on casters, behind the security desk, which the public could access. I said no to the invite and went on my way. The 4 hearings went down the toilet

Posted by: Irish Wampanoag

Personally I have never ran into any district court telling me to secure my gun or to come in plain clothes. Superior trial court is the only court I have ever been told not to come in police uniform.

Posted by: pahapoika

are we talking about the lock up at the court house ?

talked to our transportation guys today and they said if your chaining up prisoners in the cell area , they have you secure your sidearm like any other jail.

the county transportation guys said they go up stairs and sit in on cases and nobody says boo to them.

and no slight intended to the court officers. personally i think they should carry big cannons like the one Bull had in his shoulder rig on the show Night Court

Posted by: Delta784

Quote:

Originally Posted by pahapoika

are we talking about the lock up at the court house ?

Court house. I can't carry a weapon into my own cellblock, never mind someone else's.

Posted by: pahapoika

Tommy Rose was killed at Area A with his own sidearm because they had suspects hand cuffed to the wall and officers were in close proximity to them.

my guess is it's standard policy for all departments to check their weapon in when entering a cell area in this day and age.

just found it strange officers would relinquish their sidearm before entering a courthouse

Posted by: Delta784

Quote:

Originally Posted by pahapoika

Tommy Rose was killed at Area A with his own sidearm because they had suspects hand cuffed to the wall and officers were in close proximity to them.

He also had his gun just stuck in his waistband, it was as easy as reaching out and taking it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pahapoika

my guess is it's standard policy for all departments to check their weapon in when entering a cell area in this day and age.

It is now, although in practice there are exceptions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pahapoika

just found it strange officers would relinquish their sidearm before entering a courthouse

No self-respecting cop would ever surrender their weapon. The few times I've been challenged by clueless nurses and secreteries at hospitals and mental health facilities, I simply ask them if they have a LTC. Invariably they don't, so I tell them I'll hand over my weapon, but as soon as they take possession, I'm going to arrest them for 269-10.

Posted by: rg1283

Quote:

Originally Posted by Delta784

At the Psych Hospital I work at, they have weapons storage lockers. I can understand the psychiatric issues with weapons and patients getting them. Seriously with Modern retention holsters (and the common sense of the police officer carrying the firearm), if its an emergency and not a paperwork or other issues, then the Police Officers should be able to go right in no questions asked. Actually CT Courts have the same great set-up as MA does for court security. However I think some Court Officers in Hartford do carry in the courthouse.

Posted by: LA Copper

[quote=pahapoika]Tommy Rose was killed at Area A with his own sidearm because they had suspects hand cuffed to the wall and officers were in close proximity to them.

my guess is it's standard policy for all departments to check their weapon in when entering a cell area in this day and age.

I went on a ride along at Area A two weeks prior to Tommy Rose being killed. I was amazed that officers were walking around the jail area with guns still on their hips (let alone unsecured in their waistbands). I was very saddened (but not suprised) two weeks later when I heard the news about Rose.

Posted by: New Hire

Quote:

Originally Posted by pahapoika

and no slight intended to the court officers. personally i think they should carry big cannons like the one Bull had in his shoulder rig on the show Night Court

none taken and I agree with you....to an extent....

have you ever seen some of the people hired for these positions??

Posted by: pahapoika

The few times I've been challenged by clueless nurses and secretaries at hospitals and mental health facilities,

glad to hear i'm not the only one getting flack from the nurses. the doctors are usually pretty cool , but some nurses................

met some nice guys over at Cambridge . we don't do many court trips , but the court officers are always decent guys.

Posted by: mpd61

Disaster waiting to happen. My buddy is a bailiff in New Hampshire. They carry revolvers and enjoy a good working relationship with the Judges. They get to work hand-in-hand with the P.O.s and deputies for surrenders etc...

Can you imagine that in Brockton District or Boston Municipal Court?
YA RIGHT!

Posted by: PBC FL Cop

Cops cannot carry their firearms into court here in Florida. However the sheriff's bailiffs, who are all in uniform, are armed in the court room. Personally I think it's wrong to disarm LEO's in court.

Posted by: LA Copper

We can carry in court here in L.A. and it doesn't matter if we're on or off-duty. Out here, the L.A. County Sheriffs' are the bailiffs and they too are armed.

The only court we can't carry in is the Federal Courthouse, where the U.S. Marshall's Security Service handles security. Even if we go in uniform, we have to disarm, which is kinda weird... Walking around in uniform with an empty holster.

Posted by: gooday

If a cop comes to the Jail they have no problem securing there firearm but at the court house there is still a good chance the wrong person could have one inside. I think in a court house cops should be able to carry, there are plenty of outbursts and you never know if there will be an escape attempt if everyone notices that nobody has a gun so the suspects friends just wait untill the next court date and bring one in. They pass druggs there somehow why not guns or knifes. How about Cha Sousa at Norfolk Superior, What if he had that shank and was slicing someones throat and tried to grab a hostage, wouldnt you wish a cop was there with a gun then.They should Just make it standard practice that anyone with direct contact to any suspects does not carry, like the court officers or the c/o's from the state or the jails. If something jumps off like a fist fight and there is no weapons involved the c/o's and the court officers and the unarmed cops will stop it and anyone armed keeps thier distance and be ready if weapons are introduced to the situation. Its not that complicated. Cops are trained professionals with thier guns, especialy protecting them. Hell even as c/o's we get pretty good training ,not close to the cops but I'm not letting go of my gun anyway. I'd be imbarrased if the guy taking it sees the shitty equipment we have. If I'm ever in court and about to get shanked by a shit bag, please do shoot the guy you wont hear a complaint from me.

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